Gun laws do they work

dan-cat said:
So do you think that guns should be banned for certain cases?
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Short answer yes
long answer:
Am I qualified to say my acquaintance should own a gun. When he ask me to use my sink hole for target practice, I was thinking .22 rifles pop, po, pop. When he showed up with many assault rifles BOOM! BOOM! BOOM my neighbors went crazy. I was in OK or TX at the time and had to ask my pastor to go to my house and tell him to stop. If some sheriff doesn't like somebody and says he is not qualified, then what?
Don't say it doesn't happen.
 
That's the problem. Too many people associate gun control as "you're going to take away my guns!" They are the only ones screaming anything about taking away guns. I think the lobbiest intentionally scare some of the less educated gun owners into believing it so they will spread the lies.

I fully support gun ownership and everyone's right to have a gun if they choose, provided they are responsible and mentally sound. I also believe that you should be held responsible if a crime is committed or even an accident that results in someone being hurt or killed because of your negligence with your guns. We do it with anything else (someone gets electricuted for example, because you rewired your house illegally and they happen to touch some exposed wire), why not guns?
 
That's the problem. Too many people associate gun control as "you're going to take away my guns!" They are the only ones screaming anything about taking away guns. I think the lobbiest intentionally scare some of the less educated gun owners into believing it so they will spread the lies.

I fully support gun ownership and everyone's right to have a gun if they choose, provided they are responsible and mentally sound. I also believe that you should be held responsible if a crime is committed or even an accident that results in someone being hurt or killed because of your negligence with your guns. We do it with anything else (someone gets electricuted for example, because you rewired your house illegally and they happen to touch some exposed wire), why not guns?
 
Vassago said:
That's the problem. Too many people associate gun control as "you're going to take away my guns!" They are the only ones screaming anything about taking away guns. I think the lobbiest intentionally scare some of the less educated gun owners into believing it so they will spread the lies.

I fully support gun ownership and everyone's right to have a gun if they choose, provided they are responsible and mentally sound. I also believe that you should be held responsible if a crime is committed or even an accident that results in someone being hurt or killed because of your negligence with your guns. We do it with anything else (someone gets electricuted for example, because you rewired your house illegally and they happen to touch some exposed wire), why not guns?
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Hear, hear. Well said that man.
 
Vassago said:
That's the problem. Too many people associate gun control as "you're going to take away my guns!" They are the only ones screaming anything about taking away guns. I think the lobbiest intentionally scare some of the less educated gun owners into believing it so they will spread the lies.

I fully support gun ownership and everyone's right to have a gun if they choose, provided they are responsible and mentally sound. I also believe that you should be held responsible if a crime is committed or even an accident that results in someone being hurt or killed because of your negligence with your guns. We do it with anything else (someone gets electricuted for example, because you rewired your house illegally and they happen to touch some exposed wire), why not guns?
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Come on Jax, you got to be kidding. Lots of groups want to take away all guns.
 
ConnorGiles said:
I think the problem yet again is that you are mind set that the words Gun Control means that we are trying to take them away from you.

We aren't.

We simply are trying to make the holder of the firearm more responsible for their weapons by maybe putting a lock on the guns cabinet or putting them out of sight and reach of young children.

Its not about obtaining weapons, No matter where in the world people may and can obtain any weapon they choose. Be it from the black market or in america from the local.

Personally I do think that over there guns have become too much of a reliable factor in keeping yourself "safe" which I don't have a problem with. But its when people use there means of being "safe" to threaten people without provocation. That's when I have a problem with guns.

Yes over here we often don't have robbers armed with firearms. Due to their near impossibility to obtain legally. (I also hear of people on the black market offering guns and when they meet, they then rob the buyer at their own gun point :D.) This doesn't mean robberies happen less, they are just at a lower fatality rate (Yes I know it is a much smaller country but I don't doubt that the fatality rate is a high percentage of firearm deaths over there) that of course is what happens when you are "defending" yourself.

Since we seem to be asking questions that do not address gun control. Why not, I shall ask my own.

Do you class a robber stealing items from your house as a justifiable offence to fire your firearm or "defending yourself"?
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While I have not read yet? the posts following this, I will gladly answer it. If the robber is in my house without my permission and knowledge then he/she is in grave danger of meeting Mr. Smith & Wesson. By the same token if they try to hi-jack my car and I am in it, they will most likely meet Mr. Smith&Wesson. If your car is setting beside mine, which car are they going to take.
 
ConnorGiles said:
I think the problem yet again is that you are mind set that the words Gun Control means that we are trying to take them away from you.

We aren't.

We simply are trying to make the holder of the firearm more responsible for their weapons by maybe putting a lock on the guns cabinet or putting them out of sight and reach of young children.

Its not about obtaining weapons, No matter where in the world people may and can obtain any weapon they choose. Be it from the black market or in america from the local.

Personally I do think that over there guns have become too much of a reliable factor in keeping yourself "safe" which I don't have a problem with. But its when people use there means of being "safe" to threaten people without provocation. That's when I have a problem with guns.

Yes over here we often don't have robbers armed with firearms. Due to their near impossibility to obtain legally. (I also hear of people on the black market offering guns and when they meet, they then rob the buyer at their own gun point :D.) This doesn't mean robberies happen less, they are just at a lower fatality rate (Yes I know it is a much smaller country but I don't doubt that the fatality rate is a high percentage of firearm deaths over there) that of course is what happens when you are "defending" yourself.

Since we seem to be asking questions that do not address gun control. Why not, I shall ask my own.

Do you class a robber stealing items from your house as a justifiable offence to fire your firearm or "defending yourself"?
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Who is we......???????????
 
adrianscotter said:
I really need to poke my nose in here. This is a universal statement that applies to every country in the world that I have visited. If a police officer tells you to stand still, get on the ground, show him your hands or what ever, why would you not do it? I know police officers in the UK and the US and I can tell you that they all have concern for their lives when they make a stop for whatever reason. Yes, I know this off topic. I also still think that the UK gun laws are Draconian and prefer the gun laws in Florida and Texas to anywhere else in the US. I also tend to lean toward open carry rather than concealed carry because than everyone knows not to screw with anyone else.
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Tennessee's carry law does not state that it has to be concealed and now we have the law that allows a loaded handgun, long gun in the car without a permit. If you bring your horse, you can be a cowboy.lol
 
Frothingslosh said:
They already are. If you've already served prison time for holding up a store at gunpoint, you're rather unlikely to ever again be allowed a legal gun.
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In Tennessee, (am not sure about the federalies or other states), if you are convicted of 'Domestic Violence', you can never carry a gun or get a permit. Period.
Just don't hit your wife.
 
Vassago said:
That's the problem. Too many people associate gun control as "you're going to take away my guns!" They are the only ones screaming anything about taking away guns. I think the lobbiest intentionally scare some of the less educated gun owners into believing it so they will spread the lies.

I fully support gun ownership and everyone's right to have a gun if they choose, provided they are responsible and mentally sound. I also believe that you should be held responsible if a crime is committed or even an accident that results in someone being hurt or killed because of your negligence with your guns. We do it with anything else (someone gets electricuted for example, because you rewired your house illegally and they happen to touch some exposed wire), why not guns?
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good evening Vassago: Gun Control is associated with taking away or limiting Guns in such a way as to render them useless to the owner for anything else than target practice and tournament shooting.

There are two two situations that happened while I have been on this thread. One of them was an instructor allowing a minor to use a machine gun and he lost his life for it. The other, a mother or father forgot the gun was under a pillow on a couch, the baby got it and shot the mother.

Were these Accidents in your eyes?
Were these accidents preventable in your eyes? How?
Would gun control have prevented these tragedies?
Who should we put in Jail or at the very least punish? The instructors (Wife or girlfriend) or maybe the Husband?

I hear a lot about gun control but no one person has really explained how to control these guns other than background checks which are already being run on people who buy guns at a commercial establishments and/or trade shows.

Would someone give a detailed VISION of how they see gun control should work?

p.s. The city in one of those upper states that was confiscating the guns after someone died, has stopped doing that.
 
Bladerunner said:
Tennessee's carry law does not state that it has to be concealed and now we have the law that allows a loaded handgun, long gun in the car without a permit. If you bring your horse, you can be a cowboy.lol
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Well sod Florida then, I'm on my wat to TN, whoohoo...

On a serious note though, do you know off the top of your head what the TN fatality rates are for death by firearm?
 
adrianscotter said:
Well sod Florida then, I'm on my wat to TN, whoohoo...

On a serious note though, do you know off the top of your head what the TN fatality rates are for death by firearm?
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During 2011, there were 442 assault deaths among residents of Tennessee. The corresponding death rate was 6.9 per
100,000 population overall.

There were 27 unintentional (accidental) deaths in 2011 TN. out of 7 million population. What 3.8 e(-)4 power percent?


If you have a carry permit for Florida, it works in TN. The only problem is you have to go by the Florida permit as far as concealed or non-concealed .
 
Bladerunner said:
During 2011, there were 442 assault deaths among residents of Tennessee. The corresponding death rate was 6.9 per
100,000 population overall.

There were 27 unintentional (accidental) deaths in 2011 TN. out of 7 million population. What 3.8 e(-)4 power percent?


If you have a carry permit for Florida, it works in TN. The only problem is you have to go by the Florida permit as far as concealed or non-concealed .
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Hm, UK rates are much lower but then that's to be expected because we can't legally own a firearm unless we have club membership (very tight controls such as a hand gun must have a barrel length of at least 14") or you need to be a framer or a licensed pest controller for deer culling and such. Mind you, I bet bladed weapons are more prevalent as a cause of death in the UK? I'd need to look into it to be sure though. It just irritates me immensely that I can no longer hold a firearm legally in the UK as I used to be able to. I was a responsible owner, firearm and ammunition stored separately etc. but that made no difference when the government of the day had a knee jerk reaction and banned everything for everyone. @ssh0les! Perhaps I should run to be Prime Minister 😎
 
adrianscotter said:
Hm, UK rates are much lower but then that's to be expected because we can't legally own a firearm unless we have club membership (very tight controls such as a hand gun must have a barrel length of at least 14") or you need to be a framer or a licensed pest controller for deer culling and such. Mind you, I bet bladed weapons are more prevalent as a cause of death in the UK? I'd need to look into it to be sure though. It just irritates me immensely that I can no longer hold a firearm legally in the UK as I used to be able to. I was a responsible owner, firearm and ammunition stored separately etc. but that made no difference when the government of the day had a knee jerk reaction and banned everything for everyone. @ssh0les! Perhaps I should run to be Prime Minister 😎
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I understand the people overthere simply handed them in. WHy in hell did you do that. Here it would be a little different. We don't need another King although our Present Pres. thinks he is.

p.s. Tennessee's accidental gun shot deaths is probably lower than that of your countries Assault deaths by gun. That is something to worry about ????? With no guns allowed , you should have no gun violence or at least that is what a certain group of people here in the USA keep telling us. Don't you worry, that dog won't hunt.
 
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adrianscotter said:
Nearly ConnorGiles, a police officer is only justified in drawing his weapon if he believes that his or another persons life is in danger - also, the officer must be able to show that he was justified in the course of action he chose.
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That of course would be the guidelines. whether this is followed by everyone is a different story.

should a perpetrator close up to an officer when he's naked and obviously has no offensive weapon on his person (keep it clean),
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I just can't keep it clean, This made me laugh :D - Shows my age to be honest!

the officer would not be justified in shooting the perp dead, he would however, be justified in using his baton or gas depending on the risk assessment of the officer at that point in time. Obviously, the level of risk felt is extremely subjective and that's where the problems begin. What I may perceive to be a minor threat, to my wife could seem like a life threatening situation. Who would be right and who would be wrong under those circumstances? Cameras may well help.
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Camera's would be the difference between wrongly accused or justifiably accused Adrian.

Nothing bad could come of it? except people getting agitated which shouldn't happen anyway. It's just all evidence in the making.

but there will always be the people who don't want to be taped and will use force to prevent it. Sad truth.
 
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Dick7Access said:
I can’t argue with that, and I think that those on the right that do, is because they are so use to other rights being taken away little by little.
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This is another subject entirely. Personally all I see is that they're trying to make it more safe for other people.

Your right, but I see it has a cultural problem, not a weapons problem. I know of cases where a person gets in a traffic problem and issues an obscene jester and the other person says I’ll show him and takes his gun out and blows him away. I don’t get upset with things like obscene jester, but jerks do. They probable not satisfied with their life and have to make them self feel important.
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And I think those are the people who should be deprived of the weapons in the first place. If you want a weapon that badly then I would believe making the process in obtaining one be a long and patient one. Then I do believe only the people who have been checked out and approved will obtain one (legally of course)

Comes close. Why should I deprive my love ones or myself of a way of life because this jerk thinks he is entitled to it? If he gets killed he brought it on himself. If he doesn’t come into my house he doesn’t have to worry about getting killed. I would have to take each situation on its own merits. I do think a persons life is more valuable that material thinks, but then again HE is the one that made a decision that material things were more important than his life.
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Now here is where I must disagree. I'm not religious but I heard that you were. This would be you playing god, judge jury and executioner. Choosing whether he lives or dies.

He may have just been getting by, I think it would be wrong to kill the person in question just for this reason, If he was armed with intent then fair enough it would be classed as self defence.

But if he was unarmed and you unloaded your firearm into him. then that would be a different story entirely. There is many different ways in which that could be handled without the need for a death.

This yet again explains my trigger happy theory and people relying too much on firearms for "defence"
 
Dick7Access said:
Short answer yes
long answer:
Am I qualified to say my acquaintance should own a gun. When he ask me to use my sink hole for target practice, I was thinking .22 rifles pop, po, pop. When he showed up with many assault rifles BOOM! BOOM! BOOM my neighbors went crazy. I was in OK or TX at the time and had to ask my pastor to go to my house and tell him to stop. If some sheriff doesn't like somebody and says he is not qualified, then what?
Don't say it doesn't happen.
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I'm trying to work out your position on this so forgive me if I have this wrong.

You believe that some legally own guns when they shouldn't but that this belief has no bearing on what the law should rule in this case. Is that right?
 
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