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Old 03-26-2018, 12:44 PM   #136
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Re: Orlando Shootings

We are told there are 300 million + guns active in the USA.

Even if all guns were banned, and say, 200 million are destroyed, there is still a massive number for cranks to own. The mass killings will continue.

Personally, I think the problem is now too big to stop, it's like trying to ban religion - ah yes, guns are a religion in the USA.

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Old 03-26-2018, 12:52 PM   #137
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Re: Orlando Shootings

Mass killings will continue regardless of gun possession. China had a knife attack spree a few years ago. Nice saw the use of a Renault Midlum cargo truck to kill 87. Truth is people will do horrible, horrible things to one another and do not require the use of a firearm to do so. Often when something other than a gun is used, the body count is still staggering.
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Old 03-26-2018, 01:52 PM   #138
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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Nicholas Cruz is a horribly disturbed individual whom local law enforcement was very familiar with. He should have been referred to mental health providers prior to his motherís passing. He should have been dealt with during the dozens of complaints to law enforcement. He should never have passed a government background check to purchase weapons due to his issues. His horrible actions highlight a system that failed society as well as himself.
To my way of thinking, this is not a gun control issue. It is a "following up on multiple negative reports" issue. The police investigative system FAILED MISERABLY on this one. This is not a case of "guns don't kill people, people kill people." This is a case of "lazy or negligent people allow other people to kill people."

I still believe that the right to keep and bear arms is crucial in a free society. But I also believe that if you get a bunch of calls about some whack-job who is clearly unstable, you take some kind of action besides shaking your finger at the person and saying, "Don't do anything rash." If we don't have laws on the books allowing for temporary confiscation of guns from disturbed individuals, we should.

The failure may be in a group of law enforcement officers who are afraid to act against someone for fear of being sued. Has our society reached the point that the police can't act on legit tips? Given that they had several tips on Cruz and that those tips appear to have been well-founded, what more does it take?

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Old 03-26-2018, 02:19 PM   #139
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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The failure may be in a group of law enforcement officers who are afraid to act against someone for fear of being sued.
In Berkeley California the police were told to stand down, because mask wearing anarchist apparently out numbered the police. The real reason is, California and many other cities are being run by anarchists. They would rather see Berkeley burn then listen to a opposing view point. Berkeley the bastion of free speech.
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Old 03-26-2018, 10:08 PM   #140
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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Mass killings will continue regardless of gun possession. China had a knife attack spree a few years ago. Nice saw the use of a Renault Midlum cargo truck to kill 87. Truth is people will do horrible, horrible things to one another and do not require the use of a firearm to do so. Often when something other than a gun is used, the body count is still staggering.
I think religious brainwashing is a totally different ball game.

We are talking about the US insanity brigade that decide on mass killings. Yes it happens elsewhere, but not with such frequency. So what are the reasons that make people do it? It's not religion. Is it the 15 minutes of fame?

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Old 03-27-2018, 05:01 AM   #141
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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So what are the reasons that make people do it?
That is not really the appropriate question. People have been killing people for a variety of reasons for as long as "civilization" has existed. They will continue to do so in the future, for a variety of reasons.

What has changed is that world population is approaching 8 billion people, we have technological improvements, we have declining commitment to social values, and we have the rapid dissemination of news real-time. All these factors make bad news a quick and in-your-face reality. Additionally, there is a whole cadre of pundits ready to pounce on any "bad' story to psychoanalyze it.

Furthermore, in the proverbial old days, social misfits where subject to controls that today are deemed immoral and/or impractical. For example, immediate execution or banishing someone into the wilderness. The inability to implement these old solutions in today's society means that society is stuck with the social misfits and the consequences of any bad behaviour that they may exhibit.

PS: In 1940 the world population was estimated around 2 billion. In that time period we had three world leaders (Hitler, Stalin, and Mao Zedong) who were mass murders. Today, the world population is estimated around 8 billion. That would imply that we should have at least 12 world leaders today who are mass murders. Obviously, this is an unrealistic and an extreme over-the-top projection but it is something to consider.
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Old 03-27-2018, 05:52 AM   #142
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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We are talking about the US insanity brigade that decide on mass killings.
Based on population and cultural demographics, you would be best to compare the United States to the EU. Plenty of insanity to go around in both areas. Likewise in both areas there are varied legal and cultural rules that directly affect how these horrible events unfold and are reported on.

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Old 03-27-2018, 11:12 AM   #143
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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Based on population and cultural demographics, you would be best to compare the United States to the EU. Plenty of insanity to go around in both areas. Likewise in both areas there are varied legal and cultural rules that directly affect how these horrible events unfold and are reported on.
Yet again, neatly sidestepped my queries, and diverted the thread to another area. I'm too tired and bored with these forums to ask you again.

I wonder if you ever answered questions in exams. . . . , somehow I think you made up your own questions and answered them. Maybe you should be in politics.

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Old 03-27-2018, 11:27 AM   #144
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Re: Orlando Shootings

@ Colin,

Maybe if you learned to read ENGLISH and phrase questions better, you would get better answers. You started with
Quote:
I think religious brainwashing is a totally different ball game.
As such you discount religion in this conversation.

If you are unable to stop visually inspecting your colon long enough to think through a post please stop posting. When you broadcast your total ignorance of a multi-cultural society that has over 350 million people by asking silly questions I'm oft to discount your ramblings as those of the willfully ignorant.

Now if can even begin to understand that the "United States" has as many different cultural and ethnic divisions as ALL OF EUROPE you can begin to to grasp just how pathetic your posts sound.

Now I'm wondering if you ever were given an exam where the most difficult question was other than "What is two plus two".
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Old 03-27-2018, 12:00 PM   #145
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Re: Orlando Shootings

Yes, I can see the difficulty you have with the questions "so what are the reasons that make people do it", and "is it the 15 minutes of fame".

I shall try to make them easier in the future, I keep forgetting English is not your first language.

Still, if you can't manage to answer, or if you need clarification, just ask. Always happy to help the colonials whilst they struggle along.

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Old 03-27-2018, 12:43 PM   #146
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Re: Orlando Shootings

Colin, you seem to keep forgetting that my original posts regarding Nicholas are that he is mentally ill and should never have had access to a firearm, let alone free run of a school that he was expelled from. We ARE talking about the Orlando shooting, not all cases where firearms are used. If you wonder about that, please look at the title of this thread and the beginning posts. I'd expect anyone with a secondary or pre-secondary education to be able to grasp that, how ever I will be willing to help you if your having issues with this.

Now since you can't seem to remember much or are too lazy to read back through this thread, the answer to your "Why did he do this" would be "He is mentally disturbed". Not sure if you can grasp that concept or not. You may just want to check with a mental health expert to see if they can explain it to you. They may have some other questions for you as well.

Now why I am saying trying to compare the United States to smaller countries when asking question about these types of tragedies IS because insular individuals from small political units have a very difficult time grasping just how large and populous the United States is. If you have trouble with that, I'd suggest you get a good English teacher to help you with the larger words.
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Old 03-27-2018, 12:45 PM   #147
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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Now if can even begin to understand that the "United States" has as many different cultural and ethnic divisions as ALL OF EUROPE you can begin to to grasp just how pathetic your posts sound.
It's interesting that you're bordering on blaming the multi cultural element. Not too sure how blaming a failed immigration policy can make serial killing justifiable though.

Geography lesson:- Europe is made up of many different countries, it is not a country in its own right. The USA is one country.

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Old 03-27-2018, 01:13 PM   #148
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Re: Orlando Shootings

@ Colin,

Please get back to the shooter at Orlando. Not justifying his actions. He's mentally unhinged. You may recognize the symptoms. I've posted that the state of Florida failed in addressing his issues. He did not immigrate to Florida.

Geography lesson would be "The United States" is the "United" and "States". Unlike many other "Countries", the United States has sovereign states in a Republic. Hence why a State can enact laws contrary to Federal law. One of these days you may wish to learn about different governmental types. Fascinating topic. Course that would require you to also begin paying attention to other world views other than your own, so I am not sure it is something you would be comfortable with.
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Old 03-27-2018, 01:27 PM   #149
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Re: Orlando Shootings

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@ Colin,

Please get back to the shooter at Orlando. Not justifying his actions. He's mentally unhinged. You may recognize the symptoms. I've posted that the state of Florida failed in addressing his issues. He did not immigrate to Florida.

Geography lesson would be "The United States" is the "United" and "States". Unlike many other "Countries", the United States has sovereign states in a Republic. Hence why a State can enact laws contrary to Federal law. One of these days you may wish to learn about different governmental types. Fascinating topic. Course that would require you to also begin paying attention to other world views other than your own, so I am not sure it is something you would be comfortable with.
Ok, I agree that the Orlando shooter and probably the majority of other serial killers are mentally unhinged as you put it.

Re the geography lesson, it begs the question, why bother with a president and federal laws if individual states can change or ignore them? Why not have 50 different little countries?

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Old 03-27-2018, 01:35 PM   #150
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Re: Orlando Shootings

Having experienced the problems with the English Monarchy, the United States decided that such excess and deliberate suppression of the common people should never occur again. Not surprising you'd not hear about it. It is also part of why the founders of the United States decided that disarming the populace would be something they would never stand for. Do remember that it was an armed colonial populace that demonstrated just how hard it is to repress a people when they have a way to resist.

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