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Old 05-19-2018, 08:05 PM   #31
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

Although...

I did some research. Crawdads go with beer, but if you are being fancy-schmancy about it, there is some suggestion that ecrevisse (the proper French name) pairs with chardonnay. But probably not the broiled-in-hot-pepper variety of ecrevisse.

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Old 05-21-2018, 07:54 AM   #32
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

Quote:
Originally Posted by ColinEssex View Post
Imagine if they have kids, they'll come out ready tanned, but worse than that, they may not speak correct English. They may speak American.
Imagine How awful that would be.

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Old 05-21-2018, 09:51 AM   #33
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

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...who fits in with Harry's favorite charities.
Speaking of charities, I watched the BBC version of the Royal wedding. It was literally 5 hours of talking about charities with the occasional person of color talking about white privilege in the UK. It was amazing.

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Old 05-21-2018, 11:12 AM   #34
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

I understand the German reporters were obsessed with Meghan's racial mix and couldn't leave it alone. Sort of like they had never even SEEN a person of African heritage. I wonder if that report was a member of the National Socialist party?
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Old 05-21-2018, 03:29 PM   #35
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

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I understand the German reporters were obsessed with Meghan's racial mix and couldn't leave it alone. Sort of like they had never even SEEN a person of African heritage. I wonder if that report was a member of the National Socialist party?
I never saw a black person till I was aged about 10 when one rolled up at our school. It was unheard of at that time

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Old 05-21-2018, 06:14 PM   #36
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

It is unfortunate that I must agree that there were places in the USA where black faces were rare. It is even more unfortunate that some of those places were in the north of the USA - in cities formerly settled by immigrants from Germany, Austria, Norway, Sweden, and a few of the Slavic nations.

For our European friends, I wonder if the influx of black people increased as Islam in Africa became more militant, causing more refugees to emigrate. I don't know and am speculating because that level of detail is not visible to me from this side of the pond. Does any European member care to comment?
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Old 05-23-2018, 01:53 AM   #37
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

I live in the West Midlands of the UK, this is a very multi racial county, the town I live in Walsall, was mentioned by Politicians as being the most cultrally diverse town and the most cultrally segmented town in the whole of the UK.

So could I tell you if more African Immigrants have come to my town / County, honest answer I have no idea as they have been here for at least 40 to 50 years already..

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Old 06-19-2018, 10:31 PM   #38
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

I see on the news that Trump has decreed that all illegal Mexican children be separated from their families. They are kept in caged areas (as seen on BBC news) there are thousands of them.
What's next one asks, gas chambers? I thought he had a wall built to keep these nasty horrid people out.

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Old 06-19-2018, 11:13 PM   #39
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

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Originally Posted by The_Doc_Man View Post
It is even more unfortunate that some of those places were in the north of the USA - in cities formerly settled by immigrants from Germany, Austria, Norway, Sweden, and a few of the Slavic nations.

Does any European member care to comment?
Yes...

Could climate be a Factor?

I was at an auction with Robert in the middle of the summer, a stinking hot baking heat day!

The auction took place in a shed with a corrugated iron roof which just added to the oppressive heat.

Robert, a Nigerian just stood there unfazed looking completely comfortable.

I wasn't having that! I said it's alright for you Robert, you like the heat but you just wait for the winter, I'll be comfortable and you'll be freezing! No I won't he said, I will be in Nigeria!

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Old 06-20-2018, 05:27 AM   #40
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

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Originally Posted by ColinEssex
I see on the news that Trump has decreed that all illegal Mexican children be separated from their families.
Yes, this is happening, but not necessarily just Mexican children. All countries that come through Mexico as their path to the USA. This includes various nations like Nicaragua, Honduras, Ecuador, Panama, etc. - Central and South America too.

It is happening because Trump is enforcing various USA immigration laws by filing criminal charges of illegal immigration against the parents, which means they get sent to a jail. But the minors aren't being charged so no jail for them. But that leaves two other very unpleasant choices: (a) leave them roaming the streets where they could be recruited by pimps or captured by human traffickers or (b) keep them off the streets in facilities that, yes, are a type of detention. They aren't here legally either.

People in this country don't like it either, but I am (grudgingly) on Trump's side in this issue for a simple reason. In his oath of office, he swore to enforce and support the laws of the USA. This detention of children in a non-jail facility is doing that.

At every news conference where this comes up, the Trump zero-tolerance policy is clear, but so is his continued jab at Congress. THEY make the laws; he has sworn to enforce them. He is doing exactly that. He has made it clear many times that if Congress would act to change the laws, he would enforce the new laws.

Last year, when he announced his crackdown on illegals, he suspended his zero-tolerance policies for DACA for a couple of months and practically begged Congress to change that law - but they did not. This topic has come up again and again - that he does not make law and that it is up to Congress to make changes. So far, they can't agree on what to do. Trump is not blameless but he doesn't have blame for this sad situation totally on his shoulders.

I don't know how much of that makes it over the pond, but the truth is that the kids are here illegally and we are trying to stop them, send them back to where they originated, and stop the flow of people who drain our country of resources needed for our own poor people. The zero-tolerance policy is an attempt to make it clear to those who have not gotten here yet that their choice was bad. The recent policy shift on tightening asylum law is also intended to make people think twice before coming here.

Col, I know you've mentioned this theme yourself many times. The USA and the UK may have different approaches but they are both facing the same problem. Too many immigrants, not enough resources, and the newly arrived people do not quickly pay back enough in taxes to offset at least some of the cost of letting them stay.
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Old 06-20-2018, 06:16 AM   #41
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

@ Doc,

The separation of families is not mandated by law. One reason in some of the separations IS policy and stems from how some of the parents are being housed. Due to a lack of detention facilities some immigrants are being transferred to federal prisons. As the prisons are segregated by gender and lack facilities to house families, those transferred to them have their families broken up.

Now if the people trying to get in to the U.S. illegally would just give the Federal government enough notice to build and staff family friendly detention centers this wouldn't be an issue.
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Old 06-20-2018, 06:40 AM   #42
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

And above we see sophistry and denial in action.

The laws do not require children to be stripped from their parents, because they do not require immigrants to be jailed before they have their day in court. Even if you wanted to detain undocumented immigrants, it's possible to house them without breaking up the families. The stripping of children from their parents is a choice, as Trump and Sessions made clear when it started, that has been made by the administration for the express purpose of trying to scare people into not coming to the US. It is also a form of punishment without conviction (which, unfortunately, is more and more accepted in the US - another example would be asset forfeiture, which can be done by LEOs without ever charging you with a crime, and which is permanent regardless of whether you ever get charged), as well as being vile, immoral, and a crime against humanity. The administration is planning on building more cages for the children it hasn't already handed over to child traffickers; it could just as easily build facilities for entire families, but CHOOSES not to. And people like Doc will accept it because they're too caught up in 'conservatives are good, liberals are bad' to see evil when it's staring them in the face. Hell, as you see in Docs post, he'll stand there approvingly and watch as the evil is performed in front of him.

He also conveniently forgot to mention that the reason no DACA change was made was because Trump straight-up promised to veto the compromise bill that Democrats and Republicans managed to put together, expressly because it wasn't punitive enough to those people brought here as children. He made it extremely clear that his idea of 'compromise' was going to be 'do precisely what I told you to do'.

Doc said it himself - American conservatives have come to hate and despise brown children simply because their parents brought them here. Funny how 'no tolerance' doesn't extend to white people, such as, say, a realtor-turned-politician's wife who spent years living and working in the US without a visa.

This sad situation is ENTIRELY on the shoulders of Trump and the GOP politicians who have given up even the pretense of acting for any purpose other than the furthering of their own wealth and power and that of the people who own them. And the rank-and-file conservative has become so lost to all human decency that they stand there cheering as the administration shows time and again the kind of moral standards that actively begs for negative comparisons to the rise of one of the most evil regimes we've seen in the industrialized world.

To quote today's announcement by Steve Schmidt, lifelong Republican and once senior advisor to John McCain, one-time Presidential nominee for the Republican party:

Quote:
29 years and nine months ago I registered to vote and became a member of The Republican Party which was founded in 1854 to oppose slavery and stand for the dignity of human life. Today I renounce my membership in the Republican Party. It is fully the party of Trump.

It is corrupt, indecent and immoral. With the exception of a few Governors like Baker, Hogan and Kasich it is filled with feckless cowards who disgrace and dishonor the legacies of the party's greatest leaders. This child separation policy is connected to the worst abuses of humanity in our history. It is connected by the same evil that separated families during slavery and dislocated tribes and broke up Native American families. It is immoral and must be repudiated. Our country is in trouble. Our politics are badly broken.

The first step to a season of renewal in our land is the absolute and utter repudiation of Trump and his vile enablers in the 2018 election by electing Democratic majorities. I do not say this as an advocate of a progressive agenda. I say it as someone who retains belief in DEMOCRACY and decency.

On Ronald Reagan's grave are these words. " I know in my heart that man is good. That what is right will always eventually triumph and there is purpose and worth to each and every life." He would be ashamed of McConnell and Ryan and all the rest while this corrupt government establishes internment camps for babies. Everyone of these complicit leaders will carry this shame through history. There legacies will be ones of well earned ignominy. They have disgraced their country and brought dishonor to the Party of Lincoln.

I have spent much of my life working in GOP politics. I have always believed that both parties were two of the most important institutions to the advancement of human freedom and dignity in the history of the world. Today the GOP has become a danger to our democracy and values.

This Independent voter will be aligned with the only party left in America that stands for what is right and decent and remains fidelitous to our Republic, objective truth, the rule of law and our Allies. That party is the Democratic Party.
He's far from the only person to flee the GOP as it becomes a greater and greater threat to human rights as well as Democracy itself. It's just sad to see so many so-called 'Americans' cheering on an organization that is blatantly goose-stepping the US to the fascist future they apparently hold so dear.
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Old 06-20-2018, 06:47 AM   #43
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

Oh, and for the record, 'They're only following orders/they're just doing what the law says' is called the Nuremberg Defense. It didn't save the Nazis, and one can only hope it won't save ICE.
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Old 06-20-2018, 07:04 AM   #44
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

Just because it is the law doesn't mean it is right. While he cannot change the law, he does have the power to relax the enforcement of it or at least how it is interpreted to be enforced until Congress adopts the new one they are working on.

I mean, what's better? Keep separating them and creating a worse scenario for them that leads to more crime as they get older? This isn't solving the problem, it's making it worse.

How often are these children lost to their parents permanently after deportation? There was even an article the other day where a woman is suing the US because they LOST her child. She was detained and separated from him. Then she was granted a visa to stay, but they couldn't find her child after forcing the separation.
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Old 06-20-2018, 07:17 AM   #45
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Re: Trump on Pregnancy

@ Frothingslosh,

Isn't just “conservatives”. BOTH major political parties in the U.S. get involved in the same types of horrible, horrible abuse of power and blatant racism. Personally I don’t like either. BOTH are entrenched in their grabs for power.

Worst part is how each discriminates is different. Neither wants to see those who are in poverty get out.

What they do isn’t limited to “Brown” skin either. Most illegal immigrants come through the U.S./Mexican border because it is far easier to cross (and costs far less) than trying to fly in from Europe/Asia. This means that more detainees will be Hispanic than European. It doesn’t mean others are NOT detained, just that the media and politicians can point to more Hispanics as being “victims”.

For those who have money, they fly in on a visa. Their entry is “Legal”, but they “overstay”. Since they already have money they can afford a lawyer to make sure they don’t get detained. There are still Europeans who get deported, they just don’t make the news.

If there was a physical border between the U.S. and the Ukraine, you’d see the same issues but people would be talking about how “conservatives” discriminate against “Ukrainians” instead.

Please note, this is why you don’t hear about discrimination against Hispanics in Italy, but you do hear about their issues with people flooding in from Africa. Same basic problem, different groups involved.

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