Kurdistan independence referendum (1 Viewer)

Rx_

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That's right!
In true Chicago style, I sent my multiple ballots in advance.

Honestly, I hope that the Kurds can get independence.

Now for those across the Pond, this is our US version of Independence:
https://www.facebook.com/TexasSecede/
Free Poster: Texas - Most Likely To Secede

NorthEasterner: I drove 9 hours from New York to St. Louis across 5 States to see my uncle this weekend.
Texan: I drove nine hours, I was still in Texas.
 

Steve R.

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NorthEasterner: I drove 9 hours from New York to St. Louis across 5 States to see my uncle this weekend.
Texan: I drove nine hours, I was still in Texas.
Try Morehead City, NC to Murphy, NC. Just a tad under 9 hours in one state. We will be going-on to my daughter's house in Dalton, GA this week beating the passage of Hurricane Maria. The total trip (one-way) takes approximately 12 hours. We've got the pit-stops down to a science. We've been doing it several times a year for a while.
 
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Mark_

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9 hours? I know the feeling.. Took me that long to get from Westlake Village to LA on the 405 once... Almost drove 50 miles at that!
 

Rx_

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Did that many times! You MUST give me your shortcut!
 

Steve R.

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You MUST give me your shortcut!
Sorry no short cut. There is some interesting travel, a substantial portion of the trip is a very scenic, but slow, byway.

According to the Washington Times: "The final tally is not expected until the end of the week, but supporters and opponents of the referendum have little doubt that independence would get massive support."

"Just hours after polls closed Monday night, the Iraqi Defense Ministry revealed that it was planning large-scale joint military exercises with Turkey, The Associated Press reported. Earlier in the day, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, battling a violent Kurdish separatist movement in his country, threatened the Kurdish region with military intervention. Iran, which also opposed the vote, held military exercises along its border Sunday according to the AP."
 

Mark_

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There is irony here....

Three mutually antagonistic countries are banding together to maintain control of a group they all dislike....
 

Steve R.

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There is irony here....

Three mutually antagonistic countries are banding together to maintain control of a group they all dislike....
No kidding. Iraq, technically, is not a real country but an amalgamation of three discrete groups. Kurds, Sunni, and Shia. They haven't gotten along very well either.
 

Mark_

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No kidding. Iraq, technically, is not a real country but an amalgamation of three discrete groups. Kurds, Sunni, and Shia. They haven't gotten along very well either.

Worse than that... Over 100 ethnic groups in the country. Sunni/Shia is a religious difference that also crosses ethnic boundaries. The real big reason they all want control of the area is because of water resources.
 

Steve R.

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Steve R.

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According to the papers, Raqqa (the capital of ISIS) has been liberated. ISIS 'capital' Raqqa falls to U.S.-backed forces. One would think that that was good news since ISIS continues to be beaten into oblivion. But this is the Middle East. We will be entering a new era of civil strife. Iran, Iraq, and Turkey can now be expected to take coordinated military action against the "new" terrorists, the Kurds. The US needs to support the Kurds.
 
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Rx_

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Her we go with another expansion of the US without an invitation. Remember when we were promised "no boots on the ground"? It wasn't true a year ago and it appears it will continue to grow now. Quoted From a news report:

As U.S.-backed forces take victory laps in the Islamic State’s (IS) self-proclaimed capital of Raqqa, the Pentagon is considering extending its presence deeper into Syria, a move that could bring U.S. troops into contact with pro-regime forces.

Col. Ryan Dillon, a spokesman for the U.S.-led mission fighting the terror group, told reporters that the international coalition is in talks with Syrian Democratic Forces (SDF) commanders about continuing the campaign into IS-held areas along the Euphrates River following today’s victory in Raqqa. He said the more than 600 U.S. troops currently training and assisting the SDF won’t be staying in Syria “indefinitely,” but acknowledged that “there still is fighting that is left to be done.”

For now that fighting is taking SDF units straight to Deir ez-Zor, where an alliance of soldiers loyal to Bashar al-Assad, Russian troops and Iran-backed Shiite troops are trying to grapple territory back from IS and anti-regime rebels. And while the Pentagon is considering extending de-confliction agreements with Russia to cover a wider swath of Syria, former U.S. officials say it will be difficult for the U.S. military to avoid getting enmeshed in the politics of the wider war.

“You don’t want to deploy U.S. forces willy-nilly and find them in the middle of conflict,” Robert Ford, a former U.S. ambassador to Syria, told Al-Monitor. “It’s kind of a mission creep beyond going to get [IS]. They’re going to have to be dealing — as much as they don’t want to — with the politics of the Syrian civil war. It’s just unavoidable now.”
 

Steve R.

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The ability for the us to justify extending its presence deeper into Syria, may be moot. Syria is an independent country. The dissolution of ISIS will remove a veneer of legitimacy and imply that a US troop presence is not necessary. Also consider that the US is supporting groups opposed to the Assad regime. That may mean that we will be invited by the Assad regime to leave Syria.

The Iranians who are in Syria, may also view the demise of ISIS as an opportunity to initiate attacks against US troops claiming that they (Iranians) are protecting Syrian sovereignty. Additionally, as you note; the Iranians may initiate military actions against any (rebel) group opposing the Assad regime.

Finally there is Afghanistan hanging-out there. US troops in Afghanistan are sort-of "isolated". They are far from easy re-supply and stretched thin.
 

ColinEssex

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Don't forget the yanks have over 1000 troops poking their noses in near the Niger/Mali area in Africa.

For US readers, Africa is a continent outside the white picket fence of the US border.

Also remember the Taliban are still active. Maybe the USA will get another 11/9 attack. That may get to page 2 in the dailies. The latest dopey tweet from Trump will always be front page.

Col
 

Rx_

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Many in the US haven't forgot.
Our lame news agencies are afraid to even ask why troops are there.

Is it the Citizens or is it Special Interest
Many US Citizens would love to see the US pull out of 50% of these countries by December 2018. It would allow the Tax Cuts for the working class (or those with incomes under $350,000 a year) be cut in half. Then, cut our occupied countries in half again by the end of December 2019.
However, the Democrat and Republican party platforms both support the budget and structure for troops to occupy the foreign countries. This is primarily to support efforts of the World Bank, IMF and Federal Reserve.

The Minority of Citizens Support Foreign Occupation
Of US registered voters, 42% identify as independents, 29% as Democrats, 26% as Republicans, 4% Libertarians. There are 18% of the population that won't register as they feel the system is rigged or don't feel either major party represents them. There a many others that won't register to vote.

It won't Change Soon
In the US, a 3rd Party is virtually impossible to operate. Even if a 3rd party runs, the effort is basically censored. For example: In the last US Presidential election, Libertarians garnered close to 5% of the popular votes. Yet, Hillary Clinton and the national media often claimed that Hillary got a Majority of the votes. The Presidential election and a few other elections were so close that very few in close races received a Majority of votes where 3rd parties were allowed on the ballot. In addition, 156 Libertarians hold office in the US. The NES (President Regains nationalization of the National Election Service modeled after Germany's 1932 Act) reported anything but a Libertarian winning the position.


Demopublicans will unite together to maintain Foreign Occupation
Those expecting the US to leave Afghanistan should take a minute to consider this: the US still hasn’t left Germany.
about 40,000 US troops, and 179 US bases in Germany, over 50,000 troops in Japan (and 109 bases), and tens of thousands of troops, with hundreds of bases, all over Europe. Over 28,000 US troops are present in 85 bases in South Korea, and have been since 1957.
Lets not forget that the UK has bases in Seven countries.

The News Would Make Citizens Feel the US is withdrawing
Despite recently closing hundreds of bases in Iraq and Afghanistan, the United States still maintains nearly 800 military bases in more than 70 countries and territories abroad. (see map below)
Just a reminder: On Mar. 24, US President Barack Obama announced that all 9,800 US troops currently stationed in Afghanistan will remain until the end of 2015. This generated a fair amount of criticism: it was, after all, Obama’s promise that the last American troop would leave the country in 2014.


Here is an updated map of US Occupation:
https://qz.com/374138/these-are-all-the-countries-where-the-us-has-a-military-presence/
 

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