My boss stole my database!

[The_Doc_Man]

We must all remember a basic rule whether we consciously knew it or not. We NEVER get paid what we feel we are worth. We ALWAYS get paid what the employer thinks the JOB is worth - and whether we can do the job.

A feeling of being USED - or a "that's not my job" attitude - shows a form of job dissatisfaction. OK, it happens, and in a tight job market, happens a lot more often than we would like. But the whole issue is (like a troubled marriage), you must ask yourself whether you are better off as you are, or is it time to seek a change? BUT - the next step is LIVE WITH THE ANSWER for a while.

There is an old saying about "The other man's grass is always greener." But we never hear the secondary issue associated with that statement. "When seen from far away, we cannot determine the depth of fertilizer on the other man's lawn." So... just how deep will it get before YOU leave the garden?

I wish I could tell you how often I have been ready to advise someone to "take this job and shove it" - but when you have a family to feed and a house to manage, your tolerance needs to expand a bit.

 

[Bat17]

We ALWAYS get paid what the employer thinks the JOB is worth

or more likely what he can get away with. Hence the number of people who get offered pay rises when they hand in there notice!

Peter

 

[MrsGorilla]

I must admit I had a bit of that being used feeling at my last job as I worked for a very small company and didn't get paid much. However, I didn't feel I was in a position to say anything for a few reasons:

1) The job market was very tight then and there were literally thousands of unemployed IT people in our area due to a few large companies having massive layoffs when all the energy companies and telecom companies went belly up. I felt lucky just to have a job doing what I wanted to do no matter what I was being paid.

2) It was my first job out of college and so I realized I didn't have the experience to demand higher pay. My main gripe with the company was that they expected me to know (and do) EVERYTHING about EVERYTHING. I tried to be upfront with them about what I did and didn't know and I looked for (and almost always found) solutions for what I didn't know after a little research/learning on my part.

3) I realized that what I was gaining from them was equally important. From working there I got experience and learned a few new things that I was able to put on my resume which got me into the job I have now where I am much more appreciated and generally happy.

I can see both sides of the argument though. I think what Dreamweaver and Pauldohert are saying is that a company shouldn't routinely ask someone to do something they wouldn't normally do without recognizing that fact. For example, asking someone who isn't a developer to design a database. If they trust you to do it, they should be willing to pay something for it rather than just exploiting someone to get something they would normally have to pay someone else a lot more for. I can see them being unsure the first time if your skills are unproven. But it all comes down to your relationship with your employers and what you (and they) feel is normal and justified for your job position.

 

[Rich]

And we wonder why the Japs took over our industries

 

[Dreamweaver]

And we wonder why the Japs took over our industries

The Japs Haven't not at least where my firm is concerned we built a number of mixing desks that get exported to the japs as you put it.

 

[Pauldohert]

And we wonder why the Japs took over our industries

Probably because some dinosaurs think job descriprions and contracts are unnessassary and anyone who maintains they are useful and shouldn't be stepped outside is a union nut. - As a result of the dinosaurs attitudes many companies lost track of who they were employing and exactly what job they were paying them for. Funny how documentation and knowledge of exactly what your entire labour force actually does can be seen as a bad thing??

As a result they became uncompetitive against the japanese.

 

[Rich]

As a result they became uncompetitive against the japanese.

No they became uncompetitive because of a "the world and the company I work for owes me a living" mentallity

 

[Pauldohert]

No they became uncompetitive because of a "the world and the company I work for owes me a living" mentallity
__________________

Give those with a bad attitude a job description and a contract - as soon as they step outside these things and it affects the company - sack em!

Thats the last time I waste the ink in my keyboard trying to convince you of the bleedin obvious - job contracts and descriptions are a all round good thing - only to be feared by those who don't do their job for whatever reason.

 

[Lightwave]

If you're a quick learner chances are you're always going to feel you are worth more than you're getting paid.

If you're really that good then your job opportunities are going to improve outside the company even if they are not recognised within the company. I got to a point in my last job were one manager was embarrassed that I had the responsibility for my pay. 2 years later they doubled my salary cos it was getting ridiculous.

My general rules are...
Keep a keen interest in your subject matter and were possible follow those aspects that interest you - do the jobs as best you can. As far as possible do jobs that you are interested in / passionate about even if they are maybe for less money (and dare I say it no money) and keep a broad idea of what you are trying to achieve in the long term. Enjoy your achievements and plans but don't fall in love with your own ideas . Respect others and listen to all but speak your mind truthfully and clearly. A lot of people seem to think good communication is about articulation of your idea. Generally people are good at that and shoddy at listening.

If it's really that bad then probably time to get out....

Only time will tell whether this is going to work out but I'm happy.

 

[Rich]

Give those with a bad attitude a job description and a contract - as soon as they step outside these things and it affects the company - sack em!

Thats the last time I waste the ink in my keyboard trying to convince you of the bleedin obvious - job contracts and descriptions are a all round good thing - only to be feared by those who don't do their job for whatever reason.

I don't think I'll be taking your advice, I'd have to sack myself

 

[Pauldohert]

I'd have to sack myself

Told you - all round winner!

In seriuosness - you will have to explain more on that one?

 

[Brianwarnock]

Told you - all round winner!

In seriuosness - you will have to explain more on that one?

I think he must be self employed.

Brian

 

[Pauldohert]

Ta Brian - I gathered Rich was self employed - I was wondering why he needed sacking?

 

[Rich]

Ta Brian - I gathered Rich was self employed - I was wondering why he needed sacking?

Well I don't have a job description or contract to start with

 

[Pauldohert]

Who else do you employ?

 

[Rich]

Who else do you employ?

Nobody, you see I had trainees in the past who decided they weren't going to do this and that etc. All about work ethos you see, I can't be bothered to educate other's kids that I and the rest of the world doesn't owe them a living

 

[Pauldohert]

I fully agree.

 

[KalelGmoon]

Nobody, you see I had trainees in the past who decided they weren't going to do this and that etc. All about work ethos you see, I can't be bothered to educate other's kids that I and the rest of the world doesn't owe them a living

My Father in law does oil field repair work and a lot of welding. he has people who work for him that are usually just starting out, out of trade school or with no schooling. he cant afford to pay them what they think they are worth. they are always "well I could go to so and so and make twice as much" you know that BS. he tells them thats fine go and do it. heh little do they know most companies make you take tests to see your skill levels in the field. like a welding test and things of that nature. he has always told me he is kinda like a school, giving them experience and the skills they need to get those jobs that pay twice what he does.

when you are beginning you take a job not for the money, ok some for the money, but you take it to get experience and skills you need to be more competitive in the job market and to demand the higher pay you "deserve".

I know I am in much the same boat as Cindy was. I went to school to be a programmer but couldn't find a job without moving my family halfway across the country. that was not feasible, so I took a job in the IT department as a tech. you know fixing computers, filling printer ink and paper. stuff that any high school kid now a days should be able to do. I get paid for it, not what I would make by being a programmer, but it is a decent wage and we did not have to uproot the family to do it. I am gaining experience and more skills that I did not have when I go out of school, like networking, windows server and some linux, and DB management skills.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Paul

job contracts and descriptions are a all round good thing - only to be feared by those who don't do their job for whatever reason.

Sadly, in the government more than anyplace else, if the ink has dried on the job description, it is already obsolete. And xerographic printing dries pretty darned fast. But then, throughout history, managers have tried to reorganize their departments to improve their results, never learning that the problem was within them. Never learning that the best way to improve the efficiency of their department was to take a pay cut for themselves (to reduce the overhead rate). Or to seek other employment because the manager in question was a true chowderhead.

I believe one of the ancient philosophers - perhaps Cicero or Plato - discussed the frequent reorganization that occurred within a branch of government, to the point that it almost seemd that the reorganizer equated "change" with "progress." Employers who don't want to write down a job description want to make progress at the expense of understanding. They don't realize that the job description is a base on which someone can build a career path. They forget that their employees don't want a job, they want a career.

OK, some may really have just wanted a job... but MOST of any company's employees want to know where they are on a career track. And without a proper job description, you are guaranteed to be off-track.

 

[Dreamweaver]

Nobody, you see I had trainees in the past who decided they weren't going to do this and that etc. All about work ethos you see, I can't be bothered to educate other's kids that I and the rest of the world doesn't owe them a living

I have to agree there,

If you empolyed somebody as a developer regardless of the program than thay should be interested enought to have a good bash at learning new things.

All the interviews I've been too in the last thirty years, I always ask one question of the prospective empolyer "What training would be available to me should I work for you".

I'm in this cause I enjoy it regardless of the language I'm using If somebody I was working for Asked me to take on a new project that required a high learning curve I would bit there arm off one because I Understand you have to learn new things in this business and two The fact they came to me and asked me would make me feel good in that my employers thought I had what it takes to see the project through And I bet I would spend just as much time at home learning as I was at work Learnig.

Shame I'm not employeed as a developer But I'm happy as I enjoy my job and my friends there.

mick