The Deep State

[The_Doc_Man]

Your attempts to rationalise it away by trying to figure out how many possibly were carrying guns is totally irrelevant - the people who attended, went to protest against the certification of the election result and prevent that certification (following someone who had his own ego and self interest front of mind). That is the problem, this was anti-democratic. The BLM comparison is just an attempt to distract from the real issue.

I am staying out of this discussion because it is statements like this that would entice me to make argumentum ad hominem responses, and that is not dignified. Therefore, all I will say about this is a quote from the Patrick Swayze movie, Road House. "Opinions differ."

 

[moke123]

Did Nancy refuse to have the NG present?
Did the Mayor refuse to have the NG present?

Can you tell us who is responsible for deploying the NG?

 

[Pat Hartman]

NOT TRUMP. He authorized it. It was up to Nancy and the Mayor to accept or decline. If Trump had called in the guard against their wishes, what would they have called him? Yep - DICTATOR!!!!!!! The lame stream media would stillllllllllllllllll be spinning that story and YOU KNOW IT. Don't be so coy. It doesn't become you.

 

[AccessBlaster]

Can you tell us who is responsible for deploying the NG?

According to Chatty,

 

[Steve R.]

Can you tell us who is responsible for deploying the NG?

That question is moot based on the simple fact that Pelosi and Bowser both declined to mobilize the National Guard.

 

[AccessBlaster]

That question is moot based on the simple fact that Pelosi and Bowser both declined to mobilize the National Guard.

Yes, but Trump was the only one of the three who requested it. That tells me who wanted a certain result and who didn't.

 

[Jon]

Why is Pelosi not prosecuted if she declined to request the NG? Was there like a chain of command: Trump > Peloski > National Guard?

Or is this a case of the police policing themselves, so no-one gets charged. Reminds me of the FBI: "It is an internal matter."

 

[Pat Hartman]

Or is this a case of the police policing themselves, so no-one gets charged.

If they didn't charge the Capitol police officer who killed Ashlie Babbitt in cold blood with murder, they are certainly not going to charge Nancy withanything. This is the Biden "justice" system in action.

 

[GaP42]

We, as social animals, are always inferring what others in and outside our tribe are thinking @Pat Hartman - you just as much as I.
Deranged and delusional:
Intent: They sought to keep Trump in power by occupying the Capitol and preventing a joint session of Congress from counting the Electoral College votes. Noon on January 6, a "Save America" rally: Trump gave a speech in which he repeated false claims of election irregularities and said, "If you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore." Thousands of attendees, some armed, walked to the Capitol, with hundreds breaching police perimeters. Among the rioters were leaders of theat noon on January 6, at a "Save America" rally Trump gave a speech in which he repeated false claims of election irregularities and said, "If you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore." Thousands of attendees, some armed, walked to the Capitol, with hundreds breaching police perimeters. Among the rioters were leaders of the Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers militia groups, who conspired to use violence and interfere with the peaceful transfer of power. Among the rioters were Proud Boys and the Oath Keepers militia groups, who conspired to use violence and interfere with the peaceful transfer of power.
- but it is all in my head?
It was peaceful: More than 2,000 rioters entered the building, with many vandalizing and looting, including the offices of Nanacy Pelosi and others Rioters also assaulted Capitol Police officers and reporters, and attempted to capture and harm lawmakers. Gallows were erected with rioters chanting to "Hang Mike Pence" after he rejected requests, from Trump and others, to use his authority to overturn the election results. Capitol Police evacuated and locked down both chambers of Congress and several other buildings. Rioters occupied the Senate Chamber while federal law enforcement officers defended the evacuated House floor. Pipe bombs were found at the DNC and RNC. Molotov cocktails werre found in a vehicle near the Capitol
- deluded @Mike Krailo No?
Who lives in your head to condone those events? While you may think of yourselves as standing up for your political side, there is the bigger question of standing up for democracy.

 

[Pat Hartman]

- but it is all in my head?

Yes. Do we have to find hundreds of Democrat politicians using phrases like "fight like hell"? Were their supporters supposed to take the comment LITERALLY? No, they were not!!! YOU have decided to take the LITERAL interpretation because you hate DJT so anything negative is the only interpretation as far as you are concerned.

What do you call the riots where BLM and ANTIFA occupied government buildings and burned cop cars and private businesses? Were those insurrections? Show me the fires. Show me the Molotov cocktails flying through the air on Jan 6. Were are all the long guns? Do you think those Trump supporters don't have long guns?

You are choosing to believe that all those Trump supporters are just plain dumb as rocks. What else could they be if they support Trump? Is half of America really that stupid? Do you really think we are actual idiots who would take a flag to an insurrection rather than a long gun?

You are choosing to ignore every news report and Congressional hearing where it was uncovered that the FBI had agitators in the crowd. There are videos of these people trying to start a riot. These are not Trump people agitating. They are undercover FBI agents. There's no video of Trump supporters trying to agitate the crowd. WHY didn't Nancy and Bowser want the National Guard? THEY knew there was predicted to be a problem.

The fact that you cannot even bring yourself to question the "facts" you believe after all these years. Where is the pipe bomber? Was that the FBI's backup plan if they couldn't get the crowd to breach the Capitol building?

The claims of the election being stolen are not false. Clinton still thinks she won in 2016. The VP thinks Georgia and Virginia have governors that lost? If the Democrats can believe their election was stolen, why can't Trump?

with many vandalizing and looting, i

Yes, someone took stuff from Nancy's office. They also took her gavel and tried to take the podium. Show me the fires. Show me the wanton destruction. Show me the mobs rampaging through the Capitol. The only violence we see are the people who actually broke down the one door and the windows next to it. The other doors had Capitol police waving people in. Duh!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[GaP42]

Duh!.. do you think Trump is stupid and did not understand how the mob would interpret "If you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore." Irresponsible at least. You hold him in such high regard. YOU decided to take the view he is dumb then?
You seem to be obsessed about the comparing the BLM and ANTIFA with this event. Are you saying if they are insurrections this is too? No? What is it that distinguishes them that makes one an insurrection and the other not? A political element to overthrow democratic processes? Hmm.. each contains that - to varying degrees. Surely you do not want to say that there is a difference in treatment based on race?

So you think the main point was about the looting and vandalizing - or was it the attempt to prevent the count and declaration of the election result? The point raised about the vandalisation and looting and threats was in response to the completely blinkered viewpoint you and some others here that there was none or insubstantial, when clearly there was violence - it was threatening and intended to intimidate. Some people need to see the rocks thrown and injuring people and not believe that the rocks that were being stockpiled evidence of intent to harm and not build a stockade.

I can believe there are some people who are dumb as rocks that get swept up in these things - on both sides. Do you think there are granite boulders nearby?

More than 1,200 people have been charged, at least 728 pleaded guilty, another 166 defendants were convicted at trial. Those were agitators. Don't need to rely on news reports. But then you have no confidence in the justice system anyway - why put you trust in judges, juries, the application of laws (they must have just been made up specially for this by the current government). It is all lies.

Anyway enjoy the chocolate.

 

[AccessBlaster]

Quick question, why didn't Jack Smith charge Trump with Insurrection? Some people were charged with sedition, but not Insurrection as far as I know.

It seems half the country uses Insurrection in their talking points, and yet no such charges.

Secondly, why did Jack Smith wait 3 years to charge Trump, clearly he had the evidence he needed, right? By waiting until Trump is ahead and a front runner makes it look political correct?

 

[Pat Hartman]

More than 1,200 people have been charged, at least 728 pleaded guilty,

Tell me. If you had had the bad fortune of being in DC that day somewhere in the "sweep" the FBI did by using phone and CC data - illegally obtained, I might add - but who cares. The 4th amendment only applies to people you like. Probable cause be damned!!!!!!!!!!! Arrest those mother-*******. Charge them with something, anything. They can't get away with coming to a rally to support the evil orange man -- what would YOU do? Stay in jail and fight for your rights or confess to something, anything that would keep you out of jail and minimize your legal bill and your chances of losing your job just because you were in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Criminals all over the country can B&E, Shoplift, attack strangers on the street and be immediately released with no bail. Why were the people caught in the sweep arrested and held WITHOUT bail????? Come on now, I know you're not stupid. We don't hold criminals for violent crimes any more, why would we hold people accused of trespassing without bail? To exert MAXIMUM PAIN. Duh!!!!!!! How else are you going to get them to "confess" to some crime if they don't have their lives as they know them on the block.

The FBI dragged THOUSANDS of people into court. It was the crime of the century. All hands on deck. Did they catch the pipe bomber? No, they got what they wanted with all the trespassers plus the few that actually committed crimes worthy of punishment rather than a small fine. Could they figure out who left the coke in the WH? No. They didn't look at the tapes. See, that's where you get it from - the FBI. You only see what you want to see and they absolutely did NOT want to see who left the coke in the cubby.

Defund the FBI.

 

[Pat Hartman]

AND - let us not forget - the FBI withheld the Capitol internal video from the accused so it could never be used to exonerate those charged. Look what happened when the video was actually reviewed by real reporters? They followed the guy in the horns and what did the video show - a gentle man, strolling, talking to the guards, walking with the guards as they showed him around, praying. He was not leading any charge at any time and he got YEARS for his stroll. Wow, that was fair? Hmm, hit pedestrians in the head, knock them over with your scooter as you steal their purse and what do you get? released without bail. At least the shaman was finally released "early". What a travesty of justice. But I'm sure you think it is perfectly OK. Care to comment?

Do you think he got a fair trial? Do you think he got a fair sentence? Do you dare to answer?

 

[Steve R.]

More than 1,200 people have been charged,

Why haven't BLM, ANTIFA, and/or pro-abortion protesters been arrested?
(And by "arrested" meaning they went to court, were found guilty, and are now serving time in jail.)

CNN panned for on-air graphic reading 'fiery but mostly peaceful protest' in front of Kenosha fire

CNN was widely mocked late Wednesday after an on-air graphic that was broadcasted the day prior went viral.

www.foxnews.com

Rioters Set Fire to Federal Courthouse in Portland One Day after Fencing Removed

Rioters targeted the federal courthouse in Portland, Ore., on Thursday evening in renewed clashes between demonstrators and federal police. The attack on the courthouse came one day after authorities removed fencing initially erected over the summer, in response to continued riots following the...

news.yahoo.com

 

[Jon]

Duh!.. do you think Trump is stupid and did not understand how the mob would interpret "If you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore."

Let me understand your position. Are you saying that if a Democrat uses the term, "Fight like hell" then they should not be using that phrase? Or are you saying only if it is a Republican?

One other question: Do you think Trump is stupid and did not understand how the mob would interpet: "Protest peacefully"?

 

[Jon]

He was not leading any charge at any time and he got YEARS for his stroll. Wow, that was fair? Hmm, hit pedestrians in the head, knock them over with your scooter as you steal their purse and what do you get? released without bail. At least the shaman was finally released "early". What a travesty of justice. But I'm sure you think it is perfectly OK. Care to comment?

Do you think he got a fair trial? Do you think he got a fair sentence? Do you dare to answer?

I'll comment. It was a political trial, used to provide weight to the argument that Trump is a danger to democracy and he incited an insurrection.

You only have to look at what is happening with the endless lawsuits against Trump in his election year. It is a continuation of the pattern of accusing the man of things he didn't do. It started immediately with a fake salacious dossier, before he was even elected! And then Russia collusion, something the Democrat voters were convinced of for years due to the circle jerk echo chamber and 24/7 fake news coverage. But behind the scenes, the Democrat politicians knew it was a hoax because they instigated it. They spoon fed an endless drivel of lies to their supporters, who lap it up because it is what they want to believe. The truth about anything just goes out the window.

When you adopt a culture of cancel culture, you end up only hearing your own views fed back to you. See MSNBC's latest sacking for evidence. They can't take having opposing viewpoints from the other side, as it is too hurty.

 

[AccessBlaster]

It was a political trial, used to provide weight to the argument that Trump is a danger to democracy and he incited an insurrection.

Except that language doesn't appear anywhere. He was never charged with insurrection, sedition, or treason.

Jack Smith is alleging, three years after the fact.

one count of conspiracy to defraud the United States
one count of conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding
one count of obstruction of and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding
one count of conspiracy against rights

 

[Jon]

It gives the sound bite of hundreds of convictions during the January 6th riot, but much harder to prove that it had anything to do with an insurrection. They just want to convince voters that Trump is an insurrectionist, who just lump the conviction count with the insurrection argument and come to the wrong conclusion.

 

[AccessBlaster]

these two seem suspicious like they were cobbling something together

one count of conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding
one count of obstruction of and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding