A Question for Married Couples

[Kraj]

Guys always seem to have a hard time communicating true feelings, gay or straight. For a same-sex couple, I'm sure it can be even more so. You say you've discussed this with him before, what were his thoughts? You can usually gather what the outcome of the relationship will be from what you were able to learn from him.

Well, it's kind of an odd animal. Yes we've talked about it and when we have he has been receptive and understanding. And I have to be honest with myself and realize that he has been trying. The problem is it just doesn't feel like the situation is changing, and his efforts just feel so forced. I'm not sure I even know how to talk about it with him anymore. I mean, I don't want him to feel like he's forced to do things he doesn't want to do just to make me happy. And I know relationships are work, but I don't know how to work on how you feel about someone. I feel like what I want from him is for him to want to do different things and to feel differently than he does. But he can't make himself want something or feel a certain way any more than I can make him. So how can I expect him to make any kind of change if I can't even tell him what he can do?

I am by no means an expert as I'm only newly married myself, but I believe it's hard for us to make a call without knowing his side as well as yours because as they say, there are two sides to EVERY story, even a love story.

You're exactly right, which is why it's so hard for me to find someone to talk to about this. Everyone I know either would not understand or is friends with both of us so I can't really get a brutally honest opinion. But at the same time, anyone who doesn't know anything beyond what I say only gets the story from my point of view.

I don't expect you guys to come up with all the answers, but just talking about it is really helping me, I think. I hope.

I have thought, will I be angry with myself, if 20 years from now, I feel I have settled for something not quite as wonderful as I'd hoped? Or will I be angry with myself if 20 years from now, I look back and believe I threw away the best thing I could have had in search for something that just didn't exist?

That's it. That's exactly it! That's exactly the question I've been asking myself. And I think your answer makes perfect sense.

I do agree that love is a choice. In my opinion, a healthy committment does not mean "I promise to stay with you no matter how miserable or incompatible we are just because a promise is a promise". I think it means "I choose to be with you every day. I choose to fight through the tough times because I value those as much as the good times. I choose to be with you even when I'm mad as all hell at you because you make me a better person." Maybe that's a bit melodramatic, but so be it. We poofs can get away with that.

I feel like I've got more to say but nothing's coming. Meh. I've blathered plenty for one post.

Oh and Selena, sweetie: don't worry, I didn't ignore your post I just think everything I would say in response I've already said. If I catch you online, I'll take advantage of your chat offer.

 

[Ron_dK]

What would you do if you're in a relationship where your compatibility is great on every level except sexually? Your relationship is fullfilling intellectually, socially, spiritually, and emotionally but sexually you just don't feel satisfied anymore.

I guess every relationship needs maintenance. If the relationship is healthy on an intellectual, social, spiritual and emotional level ( which sounds to good to be true), but lacks sexual satisfaction, you’ll need to work on that or leave it for some time, because you might have focused too much on that aspect of life.
Sometimes a relationship might improve by some outside occurance, beyond control.
In my case, my relationship with my wife ( I’m with her for some 28 years) was deteriorating and than came the big slap ; she appeared to have cancer. Although we got thru very difficult times, she luckily recovered and looking back on that period ( some three years ago), I can only say that the relationship has grown , understanding between us have improved enormously .
I’m not saying that every relationship needs this kind of influx, but it helps you to get back on track and “observe” one and the other to see what maintenance needs to be given in what area.
If you’re not able to observe or evaluate the relationship, you may get some professional help ( psych) to help you out.
Just my 3 cts.

Ron

 

[Brianwarnock]

I choose to be with you even when I'm mad as all hell at you because you make me a better person."

Welcome to marriage

Yes Greg the troughs applied to all aspects of the relationship, the growth in the strengths was not linear, I think that quote above means you have answered your own question regarding working your way through the tough times, perhaps having children also helped, I wonder if things are different for childeless couples, as well as each situation being different.

Hope it works out for you.

Brian

 

[dt01pqt]

Not so much relationship advice but more general emotional advice. As much as we think we do as we please we are creatures of habit as well. We follow behavioural patterns. Most patters are cyclical. I learnt that from quite a bit of therapy. The problem with cyclical patterns is each element drives the problem. So for instance if guilt was one of the elements that might put you under pressure which causes you stress and then the stress makes you anxious or irritable which makes you angry. That is just a possible example it could be completely different for you. The cycle goes round and round and you feel worse. The way to break out of these cycles is to try and remove one or more of the elements by coming to terms with them.

I would be wary of what I call ultimatum syndrome. This is putting to much emphasis of one person or thing to change over night. Firstly that is a very negative way of thinking and also you need to be open minded about the future. The problem with focusing too much on the bigger picture is it is unrealistic to think you can control everything that is going to happen. What you think you want now is not what you will want later so it helps to be open-minded. Baby steps.

Anyway I think I can emphasise with you. I wouldn't say my sex drive is low but I don't really feel I can be with anyone at the moment.

Oh i'm not married btw

 

[Bodisathva]

I can only offer my experience, which is a much longer and involved than I'll subject you to here, with marriage.

My first marriage was a disaster from the start and shouldn't have begun in the first place, but that's another story. We thought we were in love. Had a child. Also had a miserable 4.5 years. The sex collapsed after the first...oh....week of marriage and everything else started to go to hell after that. All in all, a completly horrible experience and as you can imagine, a permanently scarring one. The continued decline in the sex, after the initial collapse, directly mirrored the difficulties in the relationship.

My second( current and last ) wife proved to me that I never really was in love before I met her...I never really had a relationship before her. We have a deep connection both emotionally and philosophically and spent most of the early part of our relationship just talking. The sex, by the way, has always been incredible...and it continues to get better. We just celebrated our 7th wedding anniversary in May and I could not, honestly imagine life without her. We have our spats just like any other couple, but communicate and work it out in short order.

All that to say that great sex is great, and bad sex sucks, but I believe that the quality thereof is a direct result of the emotional connection you feel with your partner (or their going rate...sorry ). A decline in emotional connectedness usually stems from other facets of the relationship. But remember that everyone has emotional cycles and to take a longterm analysis of behavior.

 

[lmnop7854]

And the question has always been, IS there anything else that would be better???? And I honestly don't know. I have thought, will I be angry with myself, if 20 years from now, I feel I have settled for something not quite as wonderful as I'd hoped? Or will I be angry with myself if 20 years from now, I look back and believe I threw away the best thing I could have had in search for something that just didn't exist?

Greg, from what I hear about your situation, it sounds like you have a very good relationship, which may be in need of a few minor tweaks. Counseling is never a bad idea, in my book, whether it be individual or both of you. Being able to see clearly about an issue makes it that much easier to handle. If you have been asking yourself the questions Tess wrote, then it may be important to look a little deeper.

In my situation, I have settled for something not anywhere near as wonderful as I DESERVE. Hope has nothing to do with it. And my individual counseling has helped me see the issues I needed to work through to get to the point where I believe that. In fact, my quote on my posts is a reminder to me.

It's never an easy decision to break up a relationship, and shouldn't be taken lightly. All possible avenues should be pursued to keep it alive, if both parties are committed.

Lisa

 

[TessB]

My husband and I went through counseling many years ago, and it did help. But, I think the only thing that was "helpful" was that there was someone there who could control the situation just by being there. Some of the emotions and thoughts that are expressed in a session could trigger some volatile reactions and having someone there to keep everyone safe.... emotionally as well as physically.... and not let it spiral out of control..... that was perhaps the only thing I can say I appreciated about having a counselor there.

Personally, I don't need someone to ask me introspective questions... I'm quite good at figuring out what my root issues are. LOL... I'm a complex person to other people, maybe... but I understand myself completely. And, I'm intuitive enough to know what to ask my husband..... IF I want to know the answers, that is.

But, that's me..... others may have different experiences with counseling. I just never met one who had more insight into my relationship than I did.

 

[TessB]

In fact, my quote on my posts is a reminder to me.

Lisa

That's so funny.... my quote has a lot to do with the way I handle my relationship too....!

 

[Pauldohert]

If the sex is faultering - try ten pints first and turn the light off.

Good luck with whatever you decide!

 

[dan-cat]

By that I mean talk to your partner about your concerns and go forward from there.

Having read through the thread again I can see that you have done this already so perhaps you'll allow me to elucidate.

I think people have different wants and needs. It seems that your partner is content with the relationship as it is and you are not. So you have to ask yourself, is what is missing a want or a need? That is to say, are you prepared to continue with the relationship without the element(s) you speak of? With love comes sacrifice, as you full well know. So, IMHO, it really depends on whether you are prepared to go without.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

Kraj - I think you missed my point about communication.

You say your partner has been receptive and understanding when you have talked about this problem two or three times in the last year. That's good. But did anything change?

Next question: Communicate with YOURSELF. Go off into a corner and ask yourself WHY you feel as you do. Ask yourself WHY your sex is going down the tubes. What are you lacking? Having gone through some really intense therapy some years ago because of (herein unspecified) relationship problems from a time before I met my dear wife, I know that examining your own mind is the most painful action one can take when you have a problem. On the other hand, once you get past the muck-n-mire, the enlightenment can be nearly blinding in its ability to illuminate your life and choices.

I suggest going off into a corner to deal with this by yourself at first because at first you must clear your mind of distractions. (Why do you think that all psychiatrist offices are neutrally colored, conservatively decorated, and above all else QUIET?) At a later part of this process it will be more appropriate to bring in your partner. But at least at first, you must avoid even the slightest hint of distraction. Remember, your partner has a vested interest in you deciding you want to stay, so there is an immediate presumption of bias.

OK, so you are alone now, thinking. About what? The things that make you hurt, sad, or dissatisfied. Examine them. Compare them to past events that were similar but had a different effect. You say your sex was good before but not so good now. OK, compare current and past sexual encounters and ask the question, "What changed?" Until you can answer that question at an emotional AND intellectual level, you have nothing to discuss with your partner. Nothing at all.

In the final analysis, you have to ask the same question that many women must ask when considering whether they will leave their husbands. (I'm not suggesting which "role" you play here, just think of the raw question.) Are you better off with or without your partner? As long as the answer is "with", you have something to work on. The moment the answer becomes "without" then you have to figure out why.

Here's where I'll give you more direct advice. As you get older, your natural sex drive will diminish. The rate of diminution is different for us all, but the FACT of diminution is quite common. At some point you might find that sex has less meaning than companionship. And there is the "what will I think in 20 years" question become not merely important but CRUCIAL.

 

[KenHigg]

Kraj should now have a plethora of views / opinions to consider this weekend...

I wish you the best what ever you decide to do...

 

[Rich]

As you get older, your natural sex drive will diminish.

Isn't that why we have to get as much of it as we can while we're still young?

 

[jsanders]

Just curious…

Does your partner know about this conversation?

Having been in a relationship for 17 years, that’s only motivation, was to raise our daughter, then to be in one where we share everything, first with each other.

I choose the one where we are our first confidants.

Just a thought.

 

[ChrisO]

Jsanders, that I believe is more than ‘Just a thought’ but really cuts to the chase.

At time of posting there have been 370 views of this thread. The OP might just as well have hired a hall, invited the press, stood on the stage and without his partners permission thrown the subject open for debate.

People can air their own problems in public but not those of their partners.

There is a problem here but I think it seems to centre on personal integrity and the respect we would expect from others.

 

[ChrisO]

And if anyone doubts my statement “The OP might just as well have hired a hall, invited the press, stood on the stage and without his partners permission thrown the subject open for debate” then they should think again because it’s already in the public domain.

Do a Google search on Kraj access and see what you get…and you don’t even need to be logged in.

 

[jsanders]

Not to put to fine a point on it Kraj, but I wasn’t insinuating that you should not seek counsel; especially in this somewhat anonymous format.

I was simply wondering out loud about my own desires, and the blessing I have to be in a relationship where both of us confide in the other, about all our fears and desires.

I think that if people start out compatible then they will stay that way until some underlying conditions change it.

I sincerely hope you find your center on this one.

 

[selenau837]

You should probably speak for yourself on both counts. I've known women with bigger sex drives than me.

True I suppose

 

[TessB]

Actually, I have to ask... for my own understanding....

You eluded to the fact that, for you, gratifying sex had a lot to do with a romantic connection. And, without that romantic experience, the enjoyment of the physical pleasures of a sexual experience is thereby diminished in your view? Have I misunderstood?

The reason I ask, is.... I'm trying to ascertain the root of the issue. Is it actually a sexual incompatibility, or is it the lack of emotional, romantic ties that is affecting the pleasure of the sexual experience?

 

[ColinEssex]

Was it Groucho Marx that said "There's nothing wrong with my sex life - I pay good money for it"

Col