Copenhagen, the wash up

[Mike375]

Well, in the bible belt (south-east portion of USA), or very rural areas, I can see that. In the North, and most larger cities, I'd like to think we're smarter than that. Of all the religious people I know, only 1 of them believes in the literal truth of the bible. And she is a Bible study teacher so it kind of makes sense.

Personally, I think religion should be something that stays at home.

Rural Australia also has a much higher percentage of Bible believers.

But don't kid yourself that literal belief in the Bible is restricted to the poorly educated.

 

[Fifty2One]

I have to agree, seeing as North America did not start when Europeans invaded the land and brought along their beliefs as well as their diseases. Prior to that time there were battles for survival as necessary which was not often.

The pilgrims may have come across that way, but the forefathers of our nation certainly did not. There's too much evidence that suggests the first Presidents of the US did not believe in religion in a literal sense, but more as a guide to how to live your life. Somehow, most Americans have screwed it up along the way. Rather than using it as a moral guide, but not literally believing in god and heaven and hell, they've switched it around to where they insist they believe in god, but completely piss on the morals and rules they should follow according to the bible. There are no true Christians left in this world, just a bunch of judgemental (which of course the bible says not to do) morons who if they truly believed, would never do half of the things they do.

But I agree with Scott, most major wars have been religiously driven. Religion causes so much hatred between everyone. Just think, if it wasn't for religion, we would never have had the religious fanatic Muslims who attacked us on 9/11, causing this huge "war" on terror, making the rest of the world hate us. We would never have had the religious fanatic Christians who abuse children in Texas and live more like a Cult than a church with 13 year olds getting knocked up. We would all get along, even Col would like America...

 

[Galaxiom]

most Americans have screwed it up along the way. Rather than using it as a moral guide, but not literally believing in god and heaven and hell, they've switched it around to where they insist they believe in god, but completely piss on the morals and rules they should follow according to the bible.

The problem is not that the Bible has been abandoned as a moral guide but that it IS being followed. Those who believe the Bible provides a good guide to behaviour have either never read it or are completely hypnotised.

The morality promoted by the Bible and its like are central to the problems facing humanity. They all teach bloody-minded, fascist attitudes including genocide and ethnic cleansing. The attitues to women and children are apallingly primitive.

I strongly encourage you to read the Old Testament book of Joshua. There you will see described exactly the kind of behaviour that is the foundation of the problems facing humanity.

 

[georgedwilkinson]

Joshua is historical. Did you want the author of Joshua to candy coat it?

 

[Galaxiom]

Joshua is historical. Did you want the author of Joshua to candy coat it?

It is more than historical. It clearly describes the success of the Hebrew genocides committed against more than 32 tribes already living in "The Promised Land" as a direct manifestation of the glory of the Hebrew god and the proof of their status as "The Chosen Race". This philosophy is still taught to children today.

To this day, Zionist preachers continue to claim the occupied territories in Palestine as having been given to the Jews by God. At no point in the Bible is the glory of the massacres decried as the crime against humanity that they clearly are by any rational standard of morality.

ALL those who worship this god are party to the glorification of genocide.

If the Bible was to be published today it would be banned.

 

[georgedwilkinson]

Uh, the Bible is published today. It's one of the best selling books in the world (if not the best selling). I hadn't heard anything about it being banned.

And I'm not sure how writing about events that happened is a bannable offense. I know they used to ban books in the US, Germany, and the UK...does that still happen?

 

[Galaxiom]

Uh, the Bible is published today. It's one of the best selling books in the world (if not the best selling). I hadn't heard anything about it being banned.

And I'm not sure how writing about events that happened is a bannable offense. I know they used to ban books in the US, Germany, and the UK...does that still happen?

I meant if it was published for the first time today.

How do you think I would fare today if I was to write a book about the historically verifiable facts of the Holocaust and littered it with statements about the deaths of millions being evidence for the glory of the Third Reich and uphold Adolph Hitler as a prophet? Yet the stories are almost the same.

I notice you seized upon the easy part of my post but I would love to see your thoughts on how you deal with the fact that the Bible unambiguously glorifies genocide in the name of your deity.

 

[ColinEssex]

. . . . .I would love to see your thoughts on how you deal with the fact that the Bible unambiguously glorifies genocide in the name of your deity.

No point in asking a direct question to a Yank here, they avoid it at all costs.

I'm still waiting for questions to be answered from many months back, yet in Oregon they just can't quite manage it.

Col

 

[scott-atkinson]

I have not read the Bible end to end, so cannot comment on individual portions of it, but as far as I can ascertain, in the right hands the Bible can bring Peace, Joy, and Hope to millions, and in the wrong hands it is a Weapon of Mass Destruction..in all its derivatives, be it the New/Old testament to the Koran..

As Vassago has said it is all about the individual and how they deem to interpet the writings or the influences on them.

I acnnot think of another book that has this level of Power over people, a Book that depicts a story, that cannot be verified as being Fact, that is the danger of Religion..

 

[Adam Caramon]

No point in asking a direct question to a Yank here, they avoid it at all costs.

We're afraid you're going to trick us with your superior British wit.


I think the most obvious problem with the bible is that is was originally written in Latin at a time when the common person did not speak Latin (or at least, not well enough where the bible was universally understood). Then it was translated half a dozen times. Down the line a king got involved and had his own version published.

Even to this day, 10 people can read the bible and give you 10 different interpretations of what it means. I would think if there were a truly all-powerful being that wanted us to live a certain way he would have been a bit more clear.

At its most fundamental level, religion is control. There will always be people that want to control others, and religion is one of the most popular tools to do so.

 

[Rich]

We're afraid you're going to trick us with your superior British wit.

Be afraid, very afraid...................................

 

[ColinEssex]

We're afraid you're going to trick us with your superior British wit.

It's not that difficult to do.

Col

 

[Fifty2One]

Usually people are fed the King James Version of the bible - the British Royalty view of the religious tombe and their slant on how things should be, basically it is the 1600's version of wiki. There is a lot of revision in translations.

As far as the wit is concerned, the majority of it here is not very intellegent and very repetative whiny spins on their anti-Americanisms. Pathetically funny at times but mostly boring.

We're afraid you're going to trick us with your superior British wit.


I think the most obvious problem with the bible is that is was originally written in Latin at a time when the common person did not speak Latin (or at least, not well enough where the bible was universally understood). Then it was translated half a dozen times. Down the line a king got involved and had his own version published.

Even to this day, 10 people can read the bible and give you 10 different interpretations of what it means. I would think if there were a truly all-powerful being that wanted us to live a certain way he would have been a bit more clear.

At its most fundamental level, religion is control. There will always be people that want to control others, and religion is one of the most popular tools to do so.

 

[Rabbie]

I think the most obvious problem with the bible is that is was originally written in Latin at a time when the common person did not speak Latin (or at least, not well enough where the bible was universally understood). Then it was translated half a dozen times. Down the line a king got involved and had his own version published.

Not actually strictly correct. The New Testament was originally written in Greek before being translated at a later stage to Latin and other languages.

I believe the the Old testament was originally written in Aramaic

 

[Adam Caramon]

Not actually strictly correct. The New Testament was originally written in Greek before being translated at a later stage to Latin and other languages.

I believe the the Old testament was originally written in Aramaic

Point conceded. I still say a major problem is that the early written versions were not widely understood by the common person.

 

[Fifty2One]

Nor is the current one, apparently...

Point conceded. I still say a major problem is that the early written versions were not widely understood by the common person.

 

[scott-atkinson]

Are there any written accounts, not 100 years later as in the testaments, that Jesus existed and performed the miracles described in the scriptures?

For example, and I know that this is probably not a comparable, but we know that King Arthur as the accounts in books was a mythological character only and not factual, although their are acoounts of a person that would probably fit the description but was in no shape way or form a fitting character that fits the book description of King Arthur and his deeds..

So are their written accounts of the time that place a person who could fit Jesus's description but who could not fit the biblical description as a Miracle man..

 

[georgedwilkinson]

I notice you seized upon the easy part of my post but I would love to see your thoughts on how you deal with the fact that the Bible unambiguously glorifies genocide in the name of your deity.

Yes, I did that on purpose. It has been over 30 years since I read Joshua through and I would prefer to read it so I know what I'm talking about before I answer your question. I don't necessarily agree with your underlying assertions.

Even to this day, 10 people can read the bible and give you 10 different interpretations of what it means.

In theory, 10 people can read a book on Access and give you 11 different interpretations of what it means. Or a book on making cheese cake. Or just about anything.

Anyway, this was exactly my first thought at the part of your other question. Thus, I need to re-read before I give my equally lame opinion.

Are books evil or the people who read/write them?

 

[Brianwarnock]

Are books evil or the people who read/write them?

The so called experts who interpret them for their own agenda, tho' I have also stated as Adam did earlier that surely an intelligent super being ie God would by now have communicated better.

Brian

 

[georgedwilkinson]

Is anyone listening? How many people have gone out and actually tried to read the passage in question (the book of Joshua in the OT)? We just take other people's word? Why not read it yourself and see if God communicates with you? Communications requires 2 participants.