Algorithms Galore: The Musk Saga Continues (3 Viewers)

[Isaac]

You didn't say that. If the government provides vouchers, that could work but it would be really hard to define the amount per student since the cost of living varies so much around the country. But it would be better than the current system and dramatically reduce the leakage of funds that happens with the present allocation method.

Sorry if I wasn't clear but yeah I meant with vouchers so the money you're paying into the system for school per student you get it and you choose Arizona is doing a lot of that recently

 

[Isaac]

Other then when he has lied his way out of every misstep, and taken credit for every success. What ever happened to his promise of a great new medical program? the "best ever", the "incredible". All those Trump words.

How do you know anything about the security issues of TikTok? Other than whatever propaganda source you listen to.

I have a feeling that there's a lot of data leakage and sharing and commandeering by countries that we'd rather not think about by way of many of our apps. It seems like tick tock may have been the worst and or just a scapegoat

 

[Pat Hartman]

China has a policy of requiring all companies to disclose all information to the central committee. So anything produced by or controlled by China is suspect. All your phones and computers could be reporting to the mother ship regularly. I think that is why Trump isn't as worried by TicTok as others are. I'm sure he knows stuff we don't know.

A friend of mine is in the import business from China, mostly batteries. He ended up buying a share of a Chinese company - foreigners cannot own businesses outright {you should never loose sight of that) - because he wanted to manufacture a special battery for cell towers that phoned home and reported status periodically. The government wouldn't buy them unless he had the software rewritten by a US company.

 

[Pat Hartman]

What ever happened to his promise of a great new medical program? the "best ever", the "incredible". All those Trump words.

John McCain is what happened. You can't seem to remember that the President does not enact laws. That is the job of Congress. Congress makes laws. The Executive Branch enforces them or if you are Biden, ignores or outright breaks them. If Congress doesn't/won't do it, it doesn't get done. Executive orders are temporary fixes and do not carry the weight of law. They are emergency measures that direct employees of the Executive Branch on procedures. If Congress thinks these orders are worthy, the intention is for them to enshrine them into actual laws.

 

[Thales750]

John McCain is what happened. You can't seem to remember that the President does not enact laws. That is the job of Congress. Congress makes laws. The Executive Branch enforces them or if you are Biden, ignores or outright breaks them. If Congress doesn't/won't do it, it doesn't get done. Executive orders are temporary fixes and do not carry the weight of law. They are emergency measures that direct employees of the Executive Branch on procedures. If Congress thinks these orders are worthy, the intention is for them to enshrine them into actual laws.

And yet you blame Obama for the ACA. You seem to not understand the power of the Bully Pulpit. You seem to think it make you sound clever to talk to me like I'm an idiot.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

This is what you asked for. Winner take all. Well, we're not exactly doing all the winning now, are we?

So far, we have survived the contests. Sometimes by outright winning, such as WW II. Sometimes by outlasting, as when Reagan finally outspent the USSR and they failed to keep up.

For the record: My post #75 was in response to the implied question of why TikTok was being banned.

 

[Thales750]

So far, we have survived the contests. Sometimes by outright winning, such as WW II. Sometimes by outlasting, as when Reagan finally outspent the USSR and they failed to keep up.

For the record: My post #75 was in response to the implied question of why TikTok was being banned.

It's more complicated than that. Your phone was made in China. And, your heart meds too. But hey, we gotta stop those damn commies from knowing what we watch on TikTok.

 

[Pat Hartman]

And yet you blame Obama for the ACA.

Only because he repeatedly told bald-faced LIES to the American public to sell the plan. They refused to talk about what the bill really contained and Pelosi's most famous line comes from that era. "You have to pass the bill to know what's in it".

If Obama and the Democrats had told the truth about the ADA, the bill would never have passed. What did the House have? 2 days to read a couple of thousand of pages and figure out what it all meant. The media - ALL OF IT - failed miserably to inform the public of how bad the bill was and that Obama was telling outright lies about how it would impact the average family. AND HE KNEW IT. Members of the Congressional office that audits bills and scores them testified to Congress after the fact that Obama was briefed and KNEW the bill would NOT save the average family any money and could cost significantly more than existing plans. Forcing insurance companies to offer pregnancy coverage on EVERY policy was one of the more stupid rules. I guess it was a misguided attempt to spread out the cost of procreating so everyone contributed. I'm not saying that the insurance industry didn't need fixing. I personally paid a very high price for my ignorance. At the time my daughter was born, policies issued to women did not automatically cover pregnancy and that is what I had. When my husband and I got married, it never occurred to us that I had to drop my coverage and be added to his plan. I couldn't add him to my plan even though it was better because I was a woman. So a few months later when I found I was pregnant, turns out that neither policy covered the pregnancy and so we footed the bill out of pocket. The cost was approximately 25% of our annual income for that year. It was a very expensive mistake. The cost was as high as it was because they gave me a staf infection during the 3 AM emergency c-section delivery and Christine and I ended up spending 10 days in the hospital instead of the normal (for the time) 3 days.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

But hey, we gotta stop those damn commies from knowing what we watch on TikTok.

I don't give a rat's patootie because I don't use TikTok. The problem is that people rather carelessly post things that CAN be critical. If someone stole or remote-hacked my phone, they would find NO financial data on it because I don't bank by phone. I do that from a PC running an up-to-date (and spontaneously updating) anti-virus package. All they would find are some old grocery lists, a few contacts, and a few conversations I haven't gotten around to deleting yet, plus some pictures. Heck, not even pix of old girlfriends - because I've been married and faithful to my wife for 30+ years. If anything, my phone is a weapon because someone going through it would be bored to death.

 

[Isaac]

Tic tok dumbs everyone down, i wouldn't miss it

 

[The_Doc_Man]

To me the "fire in a crowded theater" doctrine is relevant. TikTok "Challenges" have been the cause of hundreds of injuries and many deaths because someone posts a challenge and some lemming dives off a cliff in response.

 

[Thales750]

I don't give a rat's patootie because I don't use TikTok. The problem is that people rather carelessly post things that CAN be critical. If someone stole or remote-hacked my phone, they would find NO financial data on it because I don't bank by phone. I do that from a PC running an up-to-date (and spontaneously updating) anti-virus package. All they would find are some old grocery lists, a few contacts, and a few conversations I haven't gotten around to deleting yet, plus some pictures. Heck, not even pix of old girlfriends - because I've been married and faithful to my wife for 30+ years. If anything, my phone is a weapon because someone going through it would be bored to death.

Same here. But you strayed from the point didn't you? Our lives are an open book, and our economy is completely intertwined with most of the rest of the world. those are the facts.

We chose to get in bed with the Chinese, it's a little late to say we will never be friends with them. We better figure this out.

 

[Thales750]

Tic tok dumbs everyone down, i wouldn't miss it

The young people using it to make a living will. I don't see too many TikTok vids. I'm not a subscriber. But I do have an interest in video marketing. As such, I belong to some groups on Face Book where the main theme is building web based businesses. It's amazing the grass roots entrepreneurs making their way on streaming videos. Young people, creating and working, and disproving the image that have been assigned to their generations.

They are the casualties of this TikTok war. just like American small business succumbed to the Walmart onslaught in the 80s and 90s.

 

[GaP42]

I don’t get it:

TikTok – if the rationale is to force it to be sold to American interests because the app may secretly be used to “spy” on what you are doing/saying or influencing you, then:

If it is sold, are you not buying the “algorithm” that is TikTok? If you are buying the TikTok algorithm, then is the algorithm expected to be changed by the new owners? ie it is no longer TikTok - it is now TikTokUSA.

So TikTok USA is bought by you and that means you have the source code to modify so it no longer has the capability to “spy” on you, or no longer reports activity back to the Chinese. Would not that be apparent or discoverable in the original source code – so TikTok is exposed for what it is accused of – a security risk?

If the complete source code is not provided or what is provided compiles to something different, then what is the value of what you purchased as TikTok? How would you be confident that you obtained value for money? Even then if some apparently clean source code is provided would there not be a risk of any underhand ways in which backdoor access may still be hidden deep in the system or functions turned on thru some encrypted code?

And if the algorithm stays the same are you not stuck in the same situation? How does changing owners change things?

 

[Isaac]

then is the algorithm expected to be changed by the new owners

Either that and/or its data would presumably no longer end up on a chinese owned server

 

[Thales750]

I don’t get it:

TikTok – if the rationale is to force it to be sold to American interests because the app may secretly be used to “spy” on what you are doing/saying or influencing you, then:

If it is sold, are you not buying the “algorithm” that is TikTok? If you are buying the TikTok algorithm, then is the algorithm expected to be changed by the new owners? ie it is no longer TikTok - it is now TikTokUSA.

So TikTok USA is bought by you and that means you have the source code to modify so it no longer has the capability to “spy” on you, or no longer reports activity back to the Chinese. Would not that be apparent or discoverable in the original source code – so TikTok is exposed for what it is accused of – a security risk?

If the complete source code is not provided or what is provided compiles to something different, then what is the value of what you purchased as TikTok? How would you be confident that you obtained value for money? Even then if some apparently clean source code is provided would there not be a risk of any underhand ways in which backdoor access may still be hidden deep in the system or functions turned on thru some encrypted code?

And if the algorithm stays the same are you not stuck in the same situation? How does changing owners change things?

There's nothing to get. This is the Clash of the Titans part 4 million.

Which Billionaire has the most influence in Congress? Tune in for the latest episode.

 

[Isaac]

There's nothing to get. This is the Clash of the Titans part 4 million.

Which Billionaire has the most influence in Congress? Tune in for the latest episode.

But tik tok wasn't owned by any of those fellows, and the law banning it was legit passed by congress because the idea of an app that intimiately tracked you that was becoming wildly almost indescribably popular and was wholly Chinese worried people, as it should

 

[Pat Hartman]

I doubt that the Tic Tok app is itself sending data directly to the ChiComs. The data would be coming back to the mother ship at Tic Tok and Tic Tok would be bundling the data and sending it.

I hate the thought of the government intervening in commerce, however, national security is the government's problem and I agree that sending data, ANY data, to China is a national security problem. I object to all the biological data the ChiComs get from the ancestry sites. You KNOW they are using this to determine how they can distinguish one person or group of persons so they can create biological weapons to target them. You think Hitler was bad? Just wait until the Chinese figure out how to isolate Chinese people from everyone else. They won't think twice about trying to eliminate the rest of us. They are the ultimate racists.

Movies and books only lead actual science by a few decades at best. What the human mind can envision, it strives to create. Remember Dick Tracy's watch from the 30's? Many of you are wearing one now. We're going to Mars next year and Musk is sending up the rockets. We already know we won't find people but we might find evidence of former habitation. Personally, I'm waiting for the "beam me up Scottie" invention because when you get old, airports are a nightmare to navigate and I would still love to travel. And Heinlein's road cities are coming soon. They're being designed in Saudi Arabia. We already have the self driving cars. It's only a matter of time before people trust them enough to make all vehicles self driving. We have cars that turn into boats and cars that turn into helicopters from Ian Fleming. They don't have big guns though.

 

[Isaac]

When I walk around and look at what passes for employees in stores and businesses, when I look at the schools and who is graduating from them with what knowledge or lack thereof, when I see the good jobs filled entirely with Indians and not Americans, when I hear what Universities are teaching instead of something useful for career purposes......When I look at all that, I swear, some days I am this close to supporting government intervention in a host of areas - drastic stuff that takes certain toys away from society for their own good. This close. Not quite there yet.

I've been on teams of 35-40 people doing SQL development and been one of only 2 Americans on the team at a major bank.
That's sad. Not being racist, but I'm allowed to feel sad for my country and the way it's going.

Still hoping we can solve the problem through more serious education - but the problem is as the citizens get dumber, there is less and less appetite to agree with me, hence it is doubtful that the problem will ever be solved voluntarily. I suspect someone may have to get control some day and force what we need on us, rather than making it voluntary.

The Chinese do have their advantages in the way they govern.

They may call it Fascist or Authoritarian for me to suggest that, but unfortunately America, you may one day require a Fascist or an Authoritarian to save your dumb-a***

 

[Isaac]

airports are a nightmare to navigate and I would still love to travel.

Even when one is still young-ish, they get VERY tiresome to deal with. I feel like my family has been on a zillion trips and I have gotten SO tired of airports. My wife 'retired' (voluntary layoff during COVID) from American Airlines, and they gave her 10 years of retiree benefits. (free standby travel). Sounds like a dream come true until you start to use it. The uncertainty is stressful and that's an understatement. The not knowing if you will find space on the plane to come home Sunday night b/c you work on Monday. The running to another gate at the last minute because there was no space on the plane but we found another route through some other city. Anyway, I won't complain overall it was good, we went on a lot of trips, but I now loathe airports and air travel in general and have told my wife I am anti-trip for a while until I get my mojo back. I told her I'd rather drive for 8 hours than take a plane!!
Not to mention some airports are really nice, some are disgustingly dirty and smelly and crowded. For some reasons it's the ones in the northeast that are the nastiest. Methinks some buildings were built in 1800.