Are you an atheist?

[ConnorGiles]

One of the great ironies of the Christian faith is that it is conducted in the most conspicuous, opulent building affordable by the believers.

Yet Jesus denounced those who worshiped conspicuously.

So it is a mystery why churches exist then - If following the bible is so important then why not heed the words from it?

Christianity has always proved to be an expensive faith - e.g. the last popes throne and so forth (covered in jewels and gold) not to mention his posessions.

 

[Bladerunner]

In this case i agree with Col, and Galaxiom.

Why does one need a church? (I know I'm an atheist and its from my point of view)

You can worship a god from anywhere, having a place to congregate only seems to be a social gathering to me.(which isn't a bad thing at all, i enjoy social gatherings. but limiting it to people of faith, in my opinion is a bad thing)

I do not see many atheist buildings [/QUOTE

]

first, one does not need a church if one is an atheist! At some previous post in this thread, someone stated to me that the liberals provided far more charity than anyone else. This person never considered what the churches do for charity. In addition, those large super churches rake in a bunch of money but it is just that 'church money' The preacher only gets so much. Where does the money go. Charity for the parishioners, money to buy food, clothes, etc. for needy children. Some churches also support or own hospitals that give charity to needy people unable to pay for medical care. Some churches provide missionaries who provide medicare and other necessary commodities that small countries in the third world do not have. When was the last time you atheist did this just for the love of mankind. In one of our states, a church provided an adoption/placement service for the state. That is until the atheist in the area wanted the separation of Church and State. They had to quit and now who is taking care of the kids. The Atheist???????? lol

I could go on but if you don't get it by know there is no hope. But, before you put all Christians in a pile and burn them, you should at least get to know some of them first. Of course since you are not worried about your salvation, you can treat anyone anyway you feel is warranted.

p.s most churches do follow the rules of the bible and take care of the people in their area. It is unfortunate that you are not part of that.

 

[ConnorGiles]

]

first, one does not need a church if one is an atheist! At some previous post in this thread, someone stated to me that the liberals provided far more charity than anyone else. This person never considered what the churches do for charity. In addition, those large super churches rake in a bunch of money but it is just that 'church money' The preacher only gets so much. Where does the money go. Charity for the parishioners, money to buy food, clothes, etc. for needy children.

Im starting to see a Liberal pattern here Bladerunner

Plus if the money they are "raking in" is that much and most is given away, why would you just not set up a charity instead of having a colossal building which costs a lot to make ?

In my opinion it wouldn't make a difference if you were giving enough to the church, why cant that money go straight to charity ? (without the middle man) the charities might even make more money that way.

Some churches also support or own hospitals that give charity to needy people unable to pay for medical care. Some churches provide missionaries who provide medicare and other necessary commodities that small countries in the third world do not have. When was the last time you atheist did this just for the love of mankind. In one of our states, a church provided an adoption/placement service for the state. That is until the atheist in the area wanted the separation of Church and State. They had to quit and now who is taking care of the kids. The Atheist???????? lol

Yes SOME churches do give shelter, I know of no churches around my area which are used to give shelter to the homeless or children... As for your statement about us Atheists doing nothing for the love of mankind, I can only assume you take note of only the religious who give to charity. Also take note that Atheists give straight to charities rather than through a church which takes a sum from that charitable donation .

I could go on but if you don't get it by know there is no hope. But, before you put all Christians in a pile and burn them, you should at least get to know some of them first. Of course since you are not worried about your salvation, you can treat anyone anyway you feel is warranted.

I don't mind Christians at all - they have a right to believe what they want, as long as it doesn't get thrust in my face I don't mind. In fact I am friends with many people from different religious backgrounds and they are all pleasant .

p.s most churches do follow the rules of the bible and take care of the people in their area. It is unfortunate that you are not part of that.

As said above - No churches around my area house any people including the vicar, so it must just be an american thing because churches are locked during certain times of the day - Ill refer to what Galaxiom has told you :


Matthew

6:5 And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by others. Truly I tell you, they have received their reward in full.

6:6 But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.


Churches are Irrelevant even in the bible

 

[Galaxiom]

Quite a lot of religious charity is done as an opportunity to prosletyse.

 

[ConnorGiles]

Sort of a sorry I was wrong donation

 

[Galaxiom]

Check out the biggest charitable donors of 2013
http://philanthropy.com/article/A-Look-at-the-50-Most-Generous/144529/#p50_list

1. Mark Zuckerberg and Priscilla Chan - atheists - $ 992 million

Anyone care to research the others?

 

[Galaxiom]

Warren Buffett is another big donor - Agnostic

 

[ConnorGiles]

And Bladerunner said that Atheists do nothing for the people

 

[Frothingslosh]

Bladerunner also says that George Soros controls the US through his liberal slaves, so we can safely rest assured that he doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.

 

[ConnorGiles]

Bladerunner also says that George Soros controls the US through his liberal slaves, so we can safely rest assured that he doesn't know what the hell he's talking about.

Always can count on you to bring the big guns Frothingslosh

Hope all went okay over the weekend bud, thoughts are with you and your family.

 

[Brianwarnock]

Plus if the money they are "raking in" is that much and most is given away, why would you just not set up a charity instead of having a colossal building which costs a lot to make ?

Connor you forgot to mention "and maintain" which includes all day to day running costs such as heat and light.

Brian

 

[ConnorGiles]

I did try researching that Brian!

But could find no figures

 

[Brianwarnock]

Ok I have no actual figures but I do know a lady who looks after the finances of her church and that they are struggling to find 10 grand for the heating bill, and it can't be cheap to heat the huge cavernous cathedrals with their high ceilings.

Brian

 

[ConnorGiles]

It must not indeed!

The heating bill for my house is enough!

Wonder where that 10 grand is going to come from Charitable donations perhaps?

I hear churches don't pay regular tax too, because of being classed as a charity.

 

[ColinEssex]

I hear churches don't pay regular tax too, because of being classed as a charity.

That's just not right, the Church of England is probably the largest landowner in the UK and has mints of money, they should be taxed to the hilt, after all, all they are doing is brainwashing gullible people by pedalling a fairy story.

Col

 

[Galaxiom]

Here is an example of how churches spend money.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_John's_Cathedral_(Brisbane)

It has been under construction for over a century and probably cost over $200,000,000 in today's money.

Here are some quotes from the article.

"The third stage of construction cost A$40 million which was raised by public donations, bequests and grants from the federal, state and local governments."

Don't forget the graven images yet to be completed:
"The third stage of construction commenced in 1989 and was completed in 2009 (with the exception of 29 life sized statues on the west front and a set of cloisters on the north side of the cathedral which have yet to be commissioned). "

"To ensure enough supply of sandstone for the project, the cathedral authorities purchased a sandstone quarry at Helidon, 100 kilometres (62 mi) from Brisbane where each piece of stone was cut and finished and then trucked to the cathedral site in Ann Street."

Nothing done by halves:
"The cathedral has a peal of 12 bells hung for full circle ringing with the tenor weighing 16 hundredweight.[11] The first bells were made by John Warner & Sons in 1876 with funds raised by public subscription"

Now remember what Jesus said about conspicuous worship.

 

[Bladerunner]

Here is an example of how churches spend money.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_John's_Cathedral_(Brisbane)

It has been under construction for over a century and probably cost over $200,000,000 in today's money.

Here are some quotes from the article.

"The third stage of construction cost A$40 million which was raised by public donations, bequests and grants from the federal, state and local governments."

Don't forget the graven images yet to be completed:
"The third stage of construction commenced in 1989 and was completed in 2009 (with the exception of 29 life sized statues on the west front and a set of cloisters on the north side of the cathedral which have yet to be commissioned). "

"To ensure enough supply of sandstone for the project, the cathedral authorities purchased a sandstone quarry at Helidon, 100 kilometres (62 mi) from Brisbane where each piece of stone was cut and finished and then trucked to the cathedral site in Ann Street."

Nothing done by halves:
"The cathedral has a peal of 12 bells hung for full circle ringing with the tenor weighing 16 hundredweight.[11] The first bells were made by John Warner & Sons in 1876 with funds raised by public subscription"

Now remember what Jesus said about conspicuous worship.

Was this a Christian (Protestant, Morman , Evangelical) or Catholic Church. There is a difference. While traveling the European countryside in the early 70's, we visited a many of church that for all practical purposes was out in the middle of no-where. They were immaculate and I always wondered why? They do not need something so beautiful in order to praise God. They had one thing in common, they were Catholic churches. Why do they insist on spending huge amounts of money for churches in the countryside that wil have very few parishioners.

Of course in today's money any building is going to cost upward to $200,000.00 in price, however the price you quoted is way over the top. To be fair you have to consider the needs of the congregation when building a church.

While all are Christian Churches there is a wide variety of differences that sets the Catholic Church apart from the other Christian Churches.

 

[Galaxiom]

It is an Anglican cathedral.

1500 people turned up at the opening of the third wing in 1989. This would have been less than one in a thousand of the population of Brisbane at the time.

Both Federal and State governments contributed to the cost of construction.

 

[Frothingslosh]

Anyone who doesn't realize that Catholicism and Protenstantism are both Christian has no business trying to discuss Christianity, or honestly, religion in general. For the record, the three divisions are Catholicism, Protestantism, and Eastern Orthodoxy. Apparently, Anglicanism can be argued to be separate from Protestantism as it sprung from the English Reformation which happened at the same time as the Protestant Reformation, but that is still being argued.

Mormons are Protestants, and 'evangelical' describes an approach to one's religion, not the religion itself.

People who claim Catholics are not Christian quite simply don't know what the hell they're talking about, and very much don't know what Christianity even *IS*. Then again, with all the hatred Bladerunner has displayed in this thread, him not actually understanding anything about his own religion doesn't surprise me even slightly.

 

[AnthonyGerrard]

People who claim Catholics are not Christian quite simply don't know what the hell they're talking about, and very much don't know what Christianity even *IS*. Then again, with all the hatred Bladerunner has displayed in this thread, him not actually understanding anything about his own religion doesn't surprise me even slightly.

Who claimed that? Oh mighty one?