Are you an atheist?

[Bladerunner]

That makes me so mad...Had an article to post and it would not let me post it, Took too long to write it and it (the program) did not know who I was, I guess?

.

 

[Bladerunner]

The timeline according to the Bible is pretty correct. Especially if you take into account patterns and the numbers that show repetitiveness

Yes, The end times (tribulations) by this timeline should happen in this century.

 

[Vassago]

And with that expansion, they say we will likely never reach another galaxy as it will expand faster than we can increase technology. They even say it'll be tough enough to reach further systems within our own.

 

[Bladerunner]

What did humans living many, many years ago (back in the BC days) believe held up the earth? Only one person got it right! "He stretches out the north over the empty space, and He hung the earth on nothing" (Job 26:7)

Who knew a few thousand years ago that the winds went south, turned north, whirled continually and completed a circle from its beginning? Only one did!
"The wind goes toward the south, and it turns around to the north; it whirls around continually; and the wind returns on its circuits " (Ecclesiastes 1:6)

Did early man think the earth was flat or round like a globe? Flat but the ONE who created it knew the correct answer. "It is He Who sits above the circle of the earth, and its people are like grasshoppers;" (Isaiah 40:22)

Ur Kaśdim is mentioned four times in the Tanakh, with the distinction "Kaśdim" usually rendered in English as "of the Chaldees." In Genesis, the name is found in 11:28, 11:31 and 15:7. Although not explicitly stated in the Tanakh, it is generally understood to be the birthplace of Abraham. Genesis 11:27–28 names it as the birthplace of Abraham's brother Haran, and the point of departure of Terah's household, including his son Abram. Why is this important?

Skeptics often stated that if Scripture were true then we should be able to find the ancient city of Ur. It was found in 1854!

Have a good weekend

 

[Galaxiom]

What did humans living many, many years ago (back in the BC days) believe held up the earth? Only one person got it right! "He stretches out the north over the empty space, and He hung the earth on nothing" (Job 26:7)

Job was wrong. The Earth isn't "hung on nothing" but gravitationally bound to other objects, mainly the Sun.

 

[Bladerunner]

Job was wrong. The Earth isn't "hung on nothing" but gravitationally bound to other objects, mainly the Sun.

For a book of the Bible it was pretty close, especially since it was written 1400 years BC. If you look to out over the ocean at night, it would seem that the earth was one---flat and hung out there on nothing.

If you are talking to young children, do you start using big words like Gravitational Pull or do you tone it down some to where they can understand it in a few words. Yes, years later they will learn what Gravity actually is but until then? So it is with the Bible.

Hell, you can probably ask some California students, and they will not know what holds up the earth. (i.e. Waters World)

 

[The_Doc_Man]

If you are talking to young children, do you start using big words like Gravitational Pull or do you tone it down some to where they can understand it in a few words.

TWO sets of implications here worthy of note.

First, for the last 30 years I have said that the Bible is in the same exact category as Aesop's Fables and Grimm's Fairy Tales - stories to amuse, amaze, and (sometimes) admonish little children - because the stories were written before the advent of TV, DVDs, CDs, and even {ghack!!} cassette tapes. So the only way to keep kids quiet at night in the nomadic and small-village settlements was to have the village story-teller entertain the little brats with stories that kept their attention until they were bored to tears and fell asleep in self-defense.

But then, there is an implied arrogance that Job knew enough about gravity to tell someone (other than children) something about it. He couldn't have know doodlum-squat. It wasn't until the Italian Renaissance that gravity began to be taken as a serious thing of a scientific nature. And if instead of Job, you meant that God didn't tell anyone about gravity during the Biblical era, then what else isn't He telling us? And isn't it typical of tyrants to only tell you what they want you know?

 

[Bladerunner]

TWO sets of implications here worthy of note.

First, for the last 30 years I have said that the Bible is in the same exact category as Aesop's Fables and Grimm's Fairy Tales - stories to amuse, amaze, and (sometimes) admonish little children - because the stories were written before the advent of TV, DVDs, CDs, and even {ghack!!} cassette tapes. So the only way to keep kids quiet at night in the nomadic and small-village settlements was to have the village story-teller entertain the little brats with stories that kept their attention until they were bored to tears and fell asleep in self-defense.

But then, there is an implied arrogance that Job knew enough about gravity to tell someone (other than children) something about it. He couldn't have know doodlum-squat. It wasn't until the Italian Renaissance that gravity began to be taken as a serious thing of a scientific nature. And if instead of Job, you meant that God didn't tell anyone about gravity during the Biblical era, then what else isn't He telling us? And isn't it typical of tyrants to only tell you what they want you know?

You right Job did not no nothing but he did write what he saw and heard from God. That verse went ""He stretches out the north over the empty space, and He hung the earth on nothing" (Job 26:7). God told the people this through Job and if you look out of the night (north sky, if you did not know about gravity, it would look as though the earth was hanging in the sky by Nothing.

No, your explaination is that JOB just guessed and got it almost right???????Since there is no God, that is what he had to do. I tell you Doc,,,,,, these authors back then were actually better than the ones we have today.

I do believe I could show you a thousand things in the Bible that should not be there because of the intellect of the authors, but you would still not agree. Little things like Moses not wanting to address the Pharoah because he was not well spoken.
Of course this came out in one book...written in around 45AD and the other book (Exodus) written in 6-7 BC hundreds of miles apart, yet Exodus does not account for why Arin, Moses'e Brother spoke to the Pharoah instead of Moses. Just one of many and I know, I KNOW it was all a hoax.

If you really read the bible and don't listen to these charlatans out there, I believe you would be surprised at its complexity. A complexity that even our authors today could not come close to matching.

Don't let me stop you, I am only a messenger.

p.s. we now have people believing they are different races instead of the race they were born to...Who would have figured it would go this far??????HUmmmmmmm

We now have kids that say they are a different gender so the doctors are giving them hormones to help them through a bad time. KIDs now.... Kids that have no knowledge of Good and Evil.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

1. For Job to say/think that the Earth is "hung on nothing" is merely a misinterpretation of reality caused by lack of knowledge (in this case, about gravity.) For a slightly more modern but equally wrong class of comments, read up on the "alchemists" who originally believed in phlogiston as the physical embodiment of heat. Making a bad guess is going to give you a bad result no matter when you make that guess. To read any more than that into the situation is rubbish.

Speaking of which, the entire concept of saying that Job said something told to him by God is (to my understanding) just a way of saying that the idea in your head must have been put there by God rather than having originated within your imagination. I see the prophets as having imagined something and then presumed that God must have put it there because they didn't think they could come up with original thoughts or something. And of course, modern preachers don't want you coming up with original ideas either because then you get this notion that you can think for yourself without waiting for divine inspiration. {gasp!}

2. As to people believing they are different races than they really are? Modern genetics tell us that race is a total myth anyway, unless you limit your comments to the HUMAN race vs. some other race. As to "who would have figured it would go this far" the answer is that as soon as you make some advantage for being different, people will jump on that bandwagon as a way to "get something for nothing." It is a matter of greed or an attempt to extract some sympathy from folks whose sense of self-worth is damaged. I won't attribute that one directly to God issues, but the story of the Tower of Babel is relevant here as a reason why preachers even consider race as an issue. It was the overly religious types who used to decry the evils of "miscegenation" that led to the enforced separation of races. And that is, of course, yet another example of people speaking through ignorance of scientific reality because "race" was still a real thing to them.

3. Again, the "different gender" issue is not new. It has been around since the pre-Christian era. However, the studies I have previously referenced regarding brain scans of people to define male/female brain configuration make it clear that there is at least some science behind that problem. Further, the problem relates to conditions of birth, not conscious choices between heterosexual and homosexual behavior. The only conscious choice we have on that front is abstinence or activity. You and some others tend to be dismissive of that research claiming that it was flawed, but every paper I have found on the subject seems either to be good science or a disclaimer from a site with a religious axe to grind. I.e. their denial is motivated by non-scientific issues.

 

[Bladerunner]

1. For Job to say/think that the Earth is "hung on nothing" is merely a misinterpretation of reality caused by lack of knowledge (in this case, about gravity.) For a slightly more modern but equally wrong class of comments, read up on the "alchemists" who originally believed in phlogiston as the physical embodiment of heat. Making a bad guess is going to give you a bad result no matter when you make that guess. To read any more than that into the situation is rubbish.

Speaking of which, the entire concept of saying that Job said something told to him by God is (to my understanding) just a way of saying that the idea in your head must have been put there by God rather than having originated within your imagination. I see the prophets as having imagined something and then presumed that God must have put it there because they didn't think they could come up with original thoughts or something. And of course, modern preachers don't want you coming up with original ideas either because then you get this notion that you can think for yourself without waiting for divine inspiration. {gasp!)

Maybe you should read JOB (KJV recommended)...he was having a conversation with three friends that were trying to get him to curse the Lord for taking everything from him, indeed all things. This is one of his beliefs that he told the other fellow talking about God. "He stretcheth out the north over the empty place, and hangeth the earth upon nothing." Job 26:7......... Whether or not his belief was wrong, as it has taken almost 2000 years for us to figure it out. I kind of equivalate it to our science now that looks out into space with all our knowledge and yet makes speculations of WHY things happened? Rem, He (Job) had no knowledge, was ignorant, except there was a Sea and there be Whales (by name) in it? How did he know that,,,,Did they have boats back then???????? Of course Adam named that big fish a Whale,,,,right! and we still use it today???????

One other idea from a free willed person (ME). I hear all the time as to why God lets bad things happen to people. Yet, it is our free will that allows us to pick any road we want to go down. You say there are no visions, well... I say there are. I told of the only vision I had in a earlier post under this thread that took almost two years to come to fulfillment. To this day, after all this time, I still can still see it as I did that day it happened and I am not a prophet..

As far as the prophets go, they had visions from God, that told them of coming events including the beginning of the 'end of days'. How as ignorant as they were come up with stories that are most of the time backup within other prophets stories, miles and years away from each other. If you actually read the bible, you would change your mind. It is within your power and your power alone to live eternally but you have to make the choice.

2. As to people believing they are different races than they really are? Modern genetics tell us that race is a total myth anyway, unless you limit your comments to the HUMAN race vs. some other race. As to "who would have figured it would go this far" the answer is that as soon as you make some advantage for being different, people will jump on that bandwagon as a way to "get something for nothing." It is a matter of greed or an attempt to extract some sympathy from folks whose sense of self-worth is damaged. I won't attribute that one directly to God issues, but the story of the Tower of Babel is relevant here as a reason why preachers even consider race as an issue. It was the overly religious types who used to decry the evils of "miscegenation" that led to the enforced separation of races. And that is, of course, yet another example of people speaking through ignorance of scientific reality because "race" was still a real thing to them.

I agree with you here somewhat. We have the Human race and that is it. We have different ethnic groups within that race, German, African English, etc. and the melting pot of all of the America. There are all kinds of men who have used religion to control people throughout history. I have preachers here today that believe that you can get to heaven based upon what you do in life. Well that is partially true if you accept and have faith in Jesus Christ. Otherwise NO! They have saved a many of souls by using their methods so I cannot condemn them. For the ones that used religion for self gains, they will be dealt with and justice will be served.

do you know the story of the Tower of Babel as is told by the bible (KJV,,,only to get us on the same level) and not by some preacher you have learned parts and bits about it. Actually it is told by God himself to Moses, in Genesis 11: There was no science back then. In the case of the miracles, MAGIC ?

I am no preacher but try to inform all that the only way to God is through Jesus.

3. Again, the "different gender" issue is not new. It has been around since the pre-Christian era. However, the studies I have previously referenced regarding brain scans of people to define male/female brain configuration make it clear that there is at least some science behind that problem. Further, the problem relates to conditions of birth, not conscious choices between heterosexual and homosexual behavior. The only conscious choice we have on that front is abstinence or activity. You and some others tend to be dismissive of that research claiming that it was flawed, but every paper I have found on the subject seems either to be good science or a disclaimer from a site with a religious axe to grind. I.e. their denial is motivated by non-scientific issues.

Pre-Christian era,,,,,,, Yes it has and it has been a condemned in both old and new testaments. Then read the bible verses themselves and make up your own free willed mind that God gave you.

Actually the first form of homosexuality to be recorded was:"Genesis 9:20-24 — "The Bible’s first recorded instance of homosexual activity. Noah’s dereliction of duty as a leader allowed the activity to occur. There was no blessing of this activity, but rather a curse."

Then there is Caanan: "Genesis 10:15-19 — "Caanan, the grandson was the direct ancestor of the inhabitants of Sodom. This establishes “familiar” spirits within family associations."

Then condemation of Homosexuality (second of three) Leviticus 18:22;24-30 —"This is the second, more distinct command issued by God prohibited male/male sexual relations. Contrary to biblical revisionists who say this scripture does not foresee “committed, monogamous gay relationships, Leviticus 18:22 is a sweeping condemnation of all homosexual unions whether forced or consensual."

The other two are Leviticus 5:3 and Leviticus 20:13 There are many more throughout the books of the Bible.

The apostle Paul wrote this (New Testament): Romans 1:18-32 —Though most of the passages deal with the male perspective, for the first time there is a specific mention of female homosexuality. And as the verdict comes in, we discover it too is a depraved condition brought on by a sinful nature". Now you know why?

p.s. the new tower of babel is in Mecca. What does that tell you?

Have a great day... It is hot around here.

Blade

 

[The_Doc_Man]

KJV is TERRIBLY flawed given that King James was a misogynist KNOWN to have influenced (I won't say "bribed" or "threatened") the scribes to adjust the translations in a way to suppress women's rights, privileges, and prerogatives. When I was going through my own personal investigation into what the Bible said, KJV was a really bad version. I think the best I ever found was the Oxford New English version with Apocrypha. The ONE+A is a new translation from original language whereas KJV is a retranslation of a translation of a translation.

Using the excuse of "free will" simply means you just gave God an "out" to let bad things happen. It is the same as that trite phrase, "God works in mysterious ways." You really DON'T know anything about God (because the Bible is your only reference and your favorite version can't be trusted), but the "mysterious ways" quote is your out for cases where God's supposed action makes no sense at all. So you say "We aren't meant to understand God's choices" - yet another way of saying "I have no clue" but in mystic rather than simple language.

The problem with the KJV's story of the Tower of Babel is that it is incomplete. You need to include the Apocrypha to find out more about the full story. But in their [IRONY] infinite wisdom [/IRONY], the Council of Nicea did away with that part of the Biblical mythos.

However, I'm glad that you understand and agree that the reality of race is that it is a weak-minded person's excuse for hating someone without good cause. That poor weak-minded person who wanted to "pass as black" deserves pity for her mental shortcomings. I can't condemn her because I see her as one sick puppy.

Regarding homosexuality:

And as the verdict comes in, we discover it too is a depraved condition brought on by a sinful nature

No, it does not. The depravity is in believing that a 2000-year old ignorant viewpoint lacking a scientific basis is nonetheless relevant today. The ONLY thing of real value I have EVER found in the Bible has to do with forgiveness.

Homosexuality is a condition of birth. Are you honestly saying that a newborn baby has a sinful nature? I have seen many preachers state that a baby has a state of grace until it can make decisions. Homosexuality is NOT a decision. Abstinence vs. activity is the only REAL decision. If the research is right - and I think it is - then religious people are condemning newborns for an accident/condition of birth over which they have no control. Tell me... do you condemn someone born with a cleft palate or spina bifida or phocomelia for their conditions of birth? Do you condemn left-handers or people born deaf? (I'll bet that the answer for this list is mostly NO.) But for a condition of birth that happens to be mentioned in the Bible, you chastise and condemn innocent people.

Blade, I don't recall whether you have ever faced the situation of having a member of your family "come out" - or having your best friend from college "come out" to you. But when it hits close to home, you have to finally decide whether you want to believe a book written before your loved one was ever born, or whether you believe your loved one who tells you she is gay and it is not a choice for her to be other than gay. I have too many friends from college and my Dungeons & Dragons days who were gay and finally came out. Uniformly they said it was NOT a choice.

 

[Libre]

Homosexuality is a condition of birth.

I'm not disputing it, but the fact is, it's an untestable hypothesis. It can't be verified independently from the person's own statement, and I think it's a weak argument. This is not to say that since it's a weak argument, that I'm agreeing with Blade or that homosexuality is wrong because it says so in the bible. Let's be clear on that. I'm just saying that equality should not hinge on the assertion that it's not a choice. So what if it's a choice? All our behavior is ultimately a choice. That's why it's different from a cleft palate.

 

[Bladerunner]

I'm not disputing it, but the fact is, it's an untestable hypothesis. It can't be verified independently from the person's own statement, and I think it's a weak argument. This is not to say that since it's a weak argument, that I'm agreeing with Blade or that homosexuality is wrong because it says so in the bible. Let's be clear on that. I'm just saying that equality should not hinge on the assertion that it's not a choice. So what if it's a choice? All our behavior is ultimately a choice. That's why it's different from a cleft palate.

OK, the medical part of Cleft Palate, Spinal Bifida and other deformities are different than what the LGBT community is calling a special gene that turns on every now and then to create a Gay person from birth. Has not been identified even with our knowledge of today of the double Helical strands. (DNA)

LGBT community is about 3.8% of the American populations or 13.3 million out of 350 Million people. Does that sound like a mutation of a gene.

The Cleft Palate (approx 700 per year) simply does not grow together in early pregnancy,
The Spinal Bifida (approx. 1500 births per year) is cause in most cases by wrong amount of Folic Acid and possibly other evnironmental factors during pregnancy.
Some of the others can be a mutation of a gene caused by environmental, drug induced (drugs, alcohol, etc) or the condition and habits of the mother during pregnancy.

As you can see a complete difference.

Ancient man did not call the gay sinful but rather God did. He gave Noah the instructions to load the animals two x two (male and female). He created both Man and Woman in that when they became but one, usually 9 months later a baby was born. And so-on and so-forth........................................

Doc!!!!! that does not mean you have to hate them nor does it mean you have to ignore them. They are People for heavens sake. One of the things I get out of the Bible is "Love thy neighbor". I just do not have to accept or condone their social values no more than I would accept or condone the actions of a thief or murder.

I would like to add again, the agenda of the LGBt and liberal communities is to remove the Church from anything except in the halls of the church house and maybe within the private residence. These attacks on the Church and Christianity were foretold in the Bible and are but one of the Birth Pangs that are taking place today all over the world with an increasingly virulence and frequency.

Have a good day,,,


Blade

 

[Bladerunner]

And we have a WINNER!

With the ruling of SCOTUS, Christians across this this nation will be persecuted to the point that their very livelyhood will depend upon their acceptance of these ruling by an increasingly dictatorial government. This is going down a road foretold and not unexpected.

It appears Atheism is working its dark magic in buckets.

 

[ColinEssex]

Why is it that so called "Christians" always have to ram their beliefs down other people's throats?

They whine on and on about "he" this and "trust in The Lord that" it's basically an infringement on people's privacy.

The long and short of it is that Christianity is basically a cult and if I rabbited on about some other cult to strangers then I'd probably get a smack in the mouth, and if I did it on these forums, Gizzy would have a fit and die quietly after exercising his finger on the delete Col button.

Col

 

[Bladerunner]

Why is it that so called "Christians" always have to ram their beliefs down other people's throats?

They whine on and on about "he" this and "trust in The Lord that" it's basically an infringement on people's privacy.

The long and short of it is that Christianity is basically a cult and if I rabbited on about some other cult to strangers then I'd probably get a smack in the mouth, and if I did it on these forums, Gizzy would have a fit and die quietly after exercising his finger on the delete Col button.

Col

LOL Hi Colin..... You might be right about me geing a little leeway. Hey I am the only religious NUT on this thread that loves you and the others enough to keep on trying to get you to make the right/better choice. I promise it will no hurt you.

On the other hand Colin, The US was founded on the Christian values. Now whether or not some of the Christians follow the Lords directions is another post. the main problem is that Liberals (LGBT and others) are with the help of judicial legislation creating a dictatorial government that will take away the very rights of the Christians. I know you do not believe that by the ends days are unfolding right before you very eyes. Watch it carefully and you see that I am right.

The other day the Highest court in the land decided to redefine Marriage from between a man and a woman to anybody and any think ) when they did not define marriage in the first Place, GOD did!!!!!!!!!!!! This will result finally in the Mark of the Beast as foretold in the Bible. In other words, to eat, work, go anywhere, etc. I will have to accept the new way of life and that is the Liberal Way. If I do that, I will damn my soul, so forgive me if I do not bow my head and kiss the ring of the new fledgling dictatorial government .

Now I know you do not believe and because of that I cannot get you to see any other side than that of an atheist. However, I will keep trying.

p.s Hope you have had a good weekend, hope you have a good next week and give you wife my best!

Blade

 

[The_Doc_Man]

To Libre:

I'm not disputing it, but the fact is, it's an untestable hypothesis. It can't be verified independently from the person's own statement, and I think it's a weak argument.

A British study from the 1990s found two major factors that are relevant here.

First, the human brain has male and female configurations that show up using brain scans. In particular, the British physicians were using Positron Emission Tomography, which method has long been accepted as a valid and accurate way to examine body tissues without incisions.

Second, the extended study showed that sometimes people are born with brain and genital configuration mismatches. I.e. the plumbing does not match the wiring. In the follow-up study, the folks with clear-cut mismatches were gay.

Libre, I think that original research negates your "untestable" claim because it was tested via PET scans and follow-up research.

There are those that claim (incorrectly) that "gay" is genetic. But it is not. There is no gene for spina bifida (that I know of) and none for phocomelia (which is a birth defect caused by certain drugs in the thalidomide family, I believe). There is no gene because these and many other conditions are cause by gestational anomalies, not genetics.

To my way of thinking, any condition that manifests itself based on gestational development anomalies is NOT repeat NOT a choice for the affected infant. To me, the religious types are trying to push the incorrect viewpoint of an obscure gene so as to falsely justify their own viewpoint of hating those who are born different.

If anyone wishes to review the research, do this web search: Brain scan + homosexual

Once you have articles, look for reputable sources and be warned that a lot of religiously based sources have tried to prevent dissemination of these articles. A lot of religiously based sources have an "axe to grind" and don't want you to look at the articles with an open mind to make your own decisions. But then, fundamentalist preachers have been thinking for the religious masses for quite a long time now.

The reason nobody can find the "gay" gene is because it isn't there. It ISN'T GENETIC. It is developmental. The study shows it occurs at about the time that the brain stem starts developing in the fetus. The people who post on the topic of that research attempting to deny it all have web sites that, on evaluation, show their orientation. Hint: It is not base on open-minded responses to controversial ideas.

Now, this is my own current opinion, based on USA political belief and philosophy. ALL are created equal in the eyes of the law. To use the law to single out those who were born with an isolating condition is to pervert the law. But it goes deeper than that.

If the research is right, and I firmly believe that it is, then people are using religion (which is a conscious choice) to justify denial of rights to people whose condition is NOT a choice on their part. In other words, religious folks are CHOOSING to hate folks born with an unfortunate condition and they have to hide the hatred by claiming it to be their religious right. They have to make up LIES about how homosexuals molest children when the truth is that it is mostly heterosexual men and women who perform that kind of perversion. Sadly, a lot of the famous cases are preachers, ministers, priests, and religious extremists. That is not a legacy I would wish on anyone.

 

[spikepl]

@The_Doc_Man

So you seemingly want to argue rationally with religious freaks.

Essentially, logic and reason does not enter into this, since religion is based on neither, which is why it is called "faith". The religious ones continuously attempt to dress up their cult in some weird pseudo-logic of their own, but of course fail again and again.

If you could argue with religious people there would be no religious people, is the very real one-liner by the imaginary Dr. House.

 

[Galaxiom]

the main problem is that Liberals (LGBT and others) are with the help of judicial legislation creating a dictatorial government that will take away the very rights of the Christians.

Rubbish. What you are bemoaning is the continuing decline in the ability of the church to use its formerly privileged position to dictate its own fascist values on wider society.

The other day the Highest court in the land decided to redefine Marriage from between a man and a woman to anybody and any think ) when they did not define marriage in the first Place, GOD did!!!!!!!!!!!!

They redefined marriage to reflect the values of modern US society. About sixty percent of Americans support marriage equality and this figure continues to increase steadily. The figure is even higher among the young.

The court determined that the Constitution affords the same rights to same sex couples as it does to heterosexuals.

The institution of marriage does not belong to religion. It was taken over by the church long ago in their endless ambition to wield totalitarian power.

 

[spikepl]

BTW: To God

You don't need to keep on the sidelines in this discussion. Just post a contribution.

If you want to be discrete just give me a ring. As the omniscient almighty, you have my number.