Gun laws do they work

Bladerunner said:
surely you don't want me to refute all of these do you. I think the NRA has done so repeatedly.
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No I don't which is worrying as it seems you may have not understood my point. I simply wanted you to acknowledge that a total ban on guns is not what was being proposed.

Bladerunner said:
The ban on guns comes after the good will legislation is passed to required all the good feeling thing you people want to hear. They the simply deny me a license to carry or own. (i.e. My wife and I both sent our renewals in at the same time. Her LTC came back 2 weeks before mine did. No I have no record, not even a speeding ticket.)
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This is the jump you make that discredits you. It's total conjecture and conflicts with the facts. The gun ban legislation of 1994 expired ten years ago and was never renewed. I've given you evidence that gun law has been relaxed over the past ten years in my state. The present gun legislative proposals were fiercely opposed and rejected even in the face of horrifying circumstances. Your proposed 'slip' into total disarmament just doesn't fit with reality.


Bladerunner said:
I ask you a question. Why not enforce the present set of laws. If enforced these laws they would lower crime by targeting the criminal and their avenue of getting guns and other weapons.
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Perhaps. I wasn't addressing the effectiveness of the proposals but your manner of rejecting them. So your LTC took 2 weeks longer than expected. What does that have anything to do with the collapse of our society?


NO! No feel good legislation is going to work. This kid was a nut case that somebody missed. Most of these people are mental and leave red herrins for everyone to see yet no one picked up on any of these problems prior to the shooting.
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You need to read the proposals again. A section is devoted to improve the chances of 'picking' these people up. (Page 4) Take another read, just that page, you'll notice that it attempts to address this exact issue.

Legislation will not even begin to address the problem. You people keep dodging the problem. Again, look to Chicago. 40 people dead in a weekend by gang shootings yet they have next to a full ban on guns in the nation.
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You people? Language not conducive to civil discussion.

May 18, 1927, in Bath Township, Michigan, that killed 38 elementary school children and six adults in total, and injured at least 58 other people.[Note 1] Kehoe first killed his wife, fire-bombed his farm and set off a major explosion in the Bath Consolidated School, before committing suicide by detonating a final explosion in his truck. It is the deadliest mass murder in a school in United States history.[1][2]

Where was the so called indignation about this mass murderer. These people again are nut cases and it will not matter they will find a way. Once the guns are confiscated, the government has a free hand to do anything (i.e. Hitler 1939)
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You know the first part of your argument held some weight until you went in with the Hitler analogy. It really undermines your position because it's such a fantastical leap to an absolute. Even if disarmament did happen, which it never will, an armed populace does not forbid a dictatorship (Iraq, Afghanistan) and an unarmed populace does not necessitate a dictatorship (pick from a variety of advanced nations).
 
It took some reading but was worth it to understand how ignorant the gun lobby is.

Blade keeps citing Chicago, well I've never been there but unless it is very different to the rest of the US I suspect that you can enter without you or your vehicle being searched for weapons, hence logically it's onto a looser, the tightening and enforcement of the regulations has to be country wide, but then I would have thought that was obvious.

Hitler is very much a red herring as pointed out by Dan.
Actually some might prefer a dictatorship to what is happening in Syria .


Brian
 
Dick7Access said:
Something interesting jut occurred to me about this thread. The more people that are killed by mentally unbalance people, the more us gun nuts cling to our guns. Then the more the anti- 2nd amendment people want to take away our guns, which the more we buy and hide guns. Round and round she goes, where she stops know body knows. If more gun laws are pasted would not the anti- 2nd amendment people expect us gun nuts to obey the law. Of course you would want us to. Is this not a fair scenario? Then why not offer us up the same thing. . I would have a lot more respect for a movement like that, than for a maneuver from some liberal judge legislating from the bench.
Ps. Shortly I am going to Biloxi MS for two and a half weeks and will not be on line as much, so I don’t want anybody thinking I am wimping out on a tough questing. Also anybody in that area want to attend a AWF lunch or dinner please contact me. We have one scheduled for Aug 12th 2014 in Jacksonville, FL
Come join us, the more the merrier.
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There is a legal way to get rid of the second amendment. Why not follow the law .It’s call repealing the 2nd amendment
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Its is next. Just heard that 44 democratic senators voted to push through a bill asking for the repeal of the 1st amendment. Of course, this would silence any and all opposition to the liberal movement by allowing congress to determine what is accepted or not accepted. After this 1st amendment is repealed, the 2nd amendment will be no trouble because it will be criminal to speak out against it. We in the US have some heavy problems that are coming our way.....
 
Bladerunner said:
Its is next. Just heard that 44 democratic senators voted to push through a bill asking for the repeal of the 1st amendment.
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It is a move to limit policical campaign spending isn't it?

As such it shouldn't really affect the First Amendment which applies to "free speech".

Campaigning is "expensive speech".;)
 
This is the jump you make that discredits you. It's total conjecture and conflicts with the facts. The gun ban legislation of 1994 expired ten years ago and was never renewed. I've given you evidence that gun law has been relaxed over the past ten years in my state. The present gun legislative proposals were fiercely opposed and rejected even in the face of horrifying circumstances. Your proposed 'slip' into total disarmament just doesn't fit with reality.
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It would seem that each of us have a design on a different scenario as to how far the ban on guns will go. For this country to become a socialism nation like most liberals want, total gun control will have to had to take place.

I was referring to the total ban on guns in Germany of 1939 by Hitler. Someone once said and I paraphrase: 'To forget history is to condemn yourself to repeat it.'

Perhaps. I wasn't addressing the effectiveness of the proposals but your manner of rejecting them. So your LTC took 2 weeks longer than expected. What does that have anything to do with the collapse of our society?
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I was addressing the amount of checking the TBI (TN) does when it comes to carry permits.I actually promote this and only stated that it took two weeks longer to receive my renewal. The statistics are that women have fewer crimes with guns than men do. Therefore, it will take longer since the background check is far more intensive (and should be) for men.

Y
ou need to read the proposals again. A section is devoted to improve the chances of 'picking' these people up. (Page 4) Take another read, just that page, you'll notice that it attempts to address this exact issue.
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Page 4?????? could not find it.

You people? Language not conducive to civil discussion.
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Guess it is better than bleeding heart liberals? However, I will refrain from mentioning the words 'you people' or 'bleeding heart liberals', etc in the future in order to be politically correct. However I will retain my right to believe that the liberals who want all these changes to the US are going to get a whole lot more than they ask for. 'Be careful what you wish for'
 
Galaxiom said:
It is a move to limit policical campaign spending isn't it?

As such it shouldn't really affect the First Amendment which applies to "free speech".

Campaigning is "expensive speech".;)
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Hey, I have some ocean front property in Arizona, you and I need to talk here, it is a good deal.

Why the call for the constitutional convention? Why change the free speech, freedom of religion, freedom of press, etc. amendment? Why not just make another law that curtails political campaign? they use laws to curtail political spending.

The truth is, for the liberals to bring about the change they want, they have to get rid of the 1st amendment as it is written. I believe the language use for this proposed bill, has a few back doors that could be used for anything especially when it comes to freedom of press. One of the first things to happens in a banana republic with a dictator is the silencing of the press. An ignorant populace is easier to control.
 
Dick7Access said:
Does this not make the anti-2nd A crowd and least start to thing about that maybe we have a cultural problem in US, and not a choice of weapon problem. Come on people 12 years old. Lord have mercy!!!
http://www.foxnews.com/us/2014/06/0...-1-times-in-failed-plot-to/?intcmp=latestnews
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Of course you have a cultural problem, but surely you are not suggesting somebody armed with a knife is as dangerous as somebody armed with an assault rifle? Bladerunner told me not to bring a knife to a gun fight so at least he sees the difference, just refuses to accept guns exacerbate the cultural problem.

Brian
 
Brianwarnock said:
Of course you have a cultural problem, but surely you are not suggesting somebody armed with a knife is as dangerous as somebody armed with an assault rifle? Bladerunner told me not to bring a knife to a gun fight so at least he sees the difference, just refuses to accept guns exacerbate the cultural problem.

Brian
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In "The Magnificent Seven", James Coburn, armed only with a knife, beat the gunslinger to the draw and killed him.

Col
 
Brianwarnock said:
Of course you have a cultural problem, but surely you are not suggesting somebody armed with a knife is as dangerous as somebody armed with an assault rifle? Bladerunner told me not to bring a knife to a gun fight so at least he sees the difference, just refuses to accept guns exacerbate the cultural problem.

Brian
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No of course not, Brian, you can kill more with a assault weapon than a knife. You can also kill more with a bomb, a tank, and etc.

Most 2nd armament guns nuts (me), and ant-2nd armament people both want to see the end of young and old innocent people being killed. The difference is 2nd A and anti-2nd A see the solution differently.
Most 2nd A people I know see taking or restricting even of any gun this way.

You come home and your house is flooded. There are many leaks. Well I can’t fix that six inch line or the four inch line right now, but I can fix that half inch line as waste of time, and anti- productive.

Most anti 2nd A people I know feel well fixing the half inch line, as at least we are doing something.

Most 2nd A people I know feel that taking away any gun from law abiding people as anti- productive, and will only put more guns in the hands of criminals and give the criminals more freedom to kill.

Most anti 2nd A people I know feel that at least it will cut down on a few deaths.
 
I love the fact that Americans can happily balance carrying killing weapons and bravely profess to kill anyone trespassing on their property with being a Christian, going to church and following the word of god (only when it suits of course).

Do you leave your guns in the vestibule when worshipping? (Worshipping God that is, not guns)

It's just one big hypocritical joke to most everyone outside the picket fence of the USA.

Col
 
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