Should taxes be raised on the wealthiest people?

[The_Doc_Man]

I don't like talking that way Doc, but you add insults when you refuse see the complete picture.

Statistics published by actual experts tell me your view is incorrect. Should I be insulted because you are using incorrect references to try to confound me? I am not trying to insult you but your comments don't line up with issues that I research in trying to answer you. At the very least this forces me to question your motives for finding or believing in questionable sources for your arguments.

%%title%%

What percentage of startups fail? Here are the main startup failure statistics to understand why startups don't survive.

luisazhou.com

In the above link, insufficient capital accounts for 38% of all startup failures. People were unable to find adequate funding.

What is the #1 reason that startups fail? One simple word: money. An estimated 38% of startups fail because they run out of cash and fail to raise new, necessary capital.

Alarming Decline In Startup Creation Presents Challenges And Opportunities For Entrepreneurs

The steep decline in new startup formation provides opportunities for future entrepreneurs to leverage the unique situation.

news.crunchbase.com

This article includes statistics on USA and Israeli companies.

The number of funding rounds in the U.S. decreased from 8,147 in 2022 to an estimated 6,050 in 2023, representing a decline of approximately 26%. Similarly, Israel saw a decline from 415 funding rounds in 2022 to an estimated 284 in 2023, reflecting a decline of approximately 32%. These chains of events have led to a reduced availability of capital for new startups, hindering their formation and growth.

Startup Funding Why It's So Hard to Raise Money - FasterCapital

Starting a business is risky. There's no two ways about it. But what exactly makes it so risky? And why do so many businesses fail? There are a number of factors that contribute to the high level of risk associated with startup businesses. First and foremost is the fact that most businesses are...

fastercapital.com

The above link discusses the issue of obtaining enough startup capital and how that is becoming more difficult.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/startups-are-dying-amid-drought-in-venture-funding-a9005ad2

If WSJ says there is a drought in venture funding, am I supposed to no believe them?

@Thales750 - I have mostly tried to stay civil, but tossing off a comment about adding insults because I don't see the complete picture? I'm truly sorry you see it that way, but my sources just don't agree with you! What's a guy to do when he hears someone say something that doesn't ring true? YOU are the one who accuses me of being behind the times, yet I have shown you four current or very recent articles on the narrow subject of raising sufficient venture capital for a new small business. Those articles seem to disagree with your position.

 

[Thales750]

Your statement related to earnings, and it was false. If you want to make a case for taxing unrealized earnings, then make it clearly.

I see, semantics are more important then the big picture. I'll try to make it more precise, scoring points like this is so e debate is obviously important.
in the end I will have plenty of supporting evidence that my position is valid.

Add to this, untaxed increases in wealth. You guys are always saying that taxes should not redistribute wealth, but that is exactly what they do. They redistribute it to the very top.

 

[Thales750]

Statistics published by actual experts tell me your view is incorrect. Should I be insulted because you are using incorrect references to try to confound me? I am not trying to insult you but your comments don't line up with issues that I research in trying to answer you. At the very least this forces me to question your motives for finding or believing in questionable sources for your arguments.

%%title%%

What percentage of startups fail? Here are the main startup failure statistics to understand why startups don't survive.

luisazhou.com

In the above link, insufficient capital accounts for 38% of all startup failures. People were unable to find adequate funding.

Alarming Decline In Startup Creation Presents Challenges And Opportunities For Entrepreneurs

The steep decline in new startup formation provides opportunities for future entrepreneurs to leverage the unique situation.

news.crunchbase.com

This article includes statistics on USA and Israeli companies.

Startup Funding Why It's So Hard to Raise Money - FasterCapital

Starting a business is risky. There's no two ways about it. But what exactly makes it so risky? And why do so many businesses fail? There are a number of factors that contribute to the high level of risk associated with startup businesses. First and foremost is the fact that most businesses are...

fastercapital.com

The above link discusses the issue of obtaining enough startup capital and how that is becoming more difficult.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/startups-are-dying-amid-drought-in-venture-funding-a9005ad2

If WSJ says there is a drought in venture funding, am I supposed to no believe them?

@Thales750 - I have mostly tried to stay civil, but tossing off a comment about adding insults because I don't see the complete picture? I'm truly sorry you see it that way, but my sources just don't agree with you! What's a guy to do when he hears someone say something that doesn't ring true? YOU are the one who accuses me of being behind the times, yet I have shown you four current or very recent articles on the narrow subject of raising sufficient venture capital for a new small busiyou think ness. Those articles seem to disagree with your position.

To your first point, you are confusing capilism, with entrepreneurialism. We are not talking about small business, we are talking about the trillions that are controlled by a small group.
Plus, there is plenty of evidence, in small business circles, that supports the theory that too much start up capital can have a negative effect.
Why do think that most people that seek funding get such a small amount from angel investors?

Its an easy answer, it's because most small businesses fail for a variety of personal faiLurs on the founders part.
Let me be clear.
This conversation is not about small businesses, or even midsized businesses it's about a small group of people that controll the majority of the assets in this country, and the world.

In no way does increasing the holding of those folks make this a better county or provide more opportunity for small businesses.

 

[Thales750]

Why do you think that the world's most successful investor believes in the ultra rich paying more taxes?
And how do you feel about Gates buying up all that farm land?

 

[AngelSpeaks]

Increase in wealth? Interest, capital gains, passive and non passive income are taxed. What is it that you do? This year I retired from income tax preparation. I'm experienced in federal and about a dozen states.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

To your first point, you are confusing capilism, with entrepreneurialism.

And YOU are deliberately evading my comments, trying to obfuscate the issue because you can't call a spade a spade. To do so would undermine your arguments. I'm done with you because we don't even speak the same language and I don't see this as a useful discussion because of that language problem. You are like the Red Queen from Wonderland, where for you, words are merely like subjects that MUST mean what you say they mean, even if dictionaries might disagree.

 

[AccessBlaster]

This thread should have been titled "Capitalism vs Socialism" or " Constitutional Federal Republic vs Democracy".

 

[Thales750]

This thread should have been titled "Capitalism vs Socialism" or " Constitutional Federal Republic vs Democracy".

Nope. Only your extream right wind blinders make you see it that way.

And YOU are deliberately evading my comments, trying to obfuscate the issue because you can't call a spade a spade. To do so would undermine your arguments. I'm done with you because we don't even speak the same language and I don't see this as a useful discussion because of that language problem. You are like the Red Queen from Wonderland, where for you, words are merely like subjects that MUST mean what you say they mean, even if dictionaries might disagree.

you are absolutely choosing to not get my points, and then you are blaming me for it. You literally brought up startups which have absolutely nothing to do with how much or how we should tax certain aspects of our society. You, along with most of the others in these discussion merely come her to have one more avenue cognitive ease.

You only seek out information that supports your political ideology and your world views, and you reject any deviation from them and you think that a chart that says that 38% of starts up fail because of lack of funding. I have been employed a total of 7 years since 1983. The rest of the time I spend selling to companies. all that while you were working for the Navy, (thank you for that) or otherwise insulated form the real world of entrepreneurs.

I started calling on businesses in 1980. My whole life has been mostly doing work for businesses. I know a thing or to about this. The reason most small businesses cant get funding is because they don't have a good plan, they are not charismatic enough, are they don't understand the fundamental job of running a small business.

Huge amounts of capital all held by the largest financial institutes and their influence in congress is the biggest obstacle to a thriving small business economy. Paid for with lowered taxes on those institutions and investment funds.

 

[The_Doc_Man]

You literally brought up startups which have absolutely nothing to do with how much or how we should tax certain aspects of our society.

Except that when taxes get too high, investment funding gets hit.

you are absolutely choosing to not get my points

No. DON'T confuse "choosing to not get your points" with "vehemently disagreeing with your points." Those two are DIFFERENT. By saying "Choosing not to GET your points" you are impugning MY intelligence. STOP THAT RIGHT NOW. "Getting" and "agreeing with" are VASTLY DIFFERENT. And if YOU don't understand that, then the problem isn't with me.

 

[Thales750]

Except that when taxes get too high, investment funding gets hit.


No. DON'T confuse "choosing to not get your points" with "vehemently disagreeing with your points." Those two are DIFFERENT. By saying "Choosing not to GET your points" you are impugning MY intelligence. STOP THAT RIGHT NOW. "Getting" and "agreeing with" are VASTLY DIFFERENT. And if YOU don't understand that, then the problem isn't with me.

You're saying that lowered taxes on the rich makes more funds availible for small business start ups?

 

[The_Doc_Man]

You're saying that lowered taxes on the rich makes more funds availible for small business start ups?

For those private investors who have investment capital, taxes reduce the amount available for investment. Bank regulations also affect the amount of capital they must retain as backing funds for depositors and such. Taxes reduce the amount of funds available to banks by causing investors to find less "stressed" wealth preservation methods.

 

[Thales750]

For those private investors who have investment capital, taxes reduce the amount available for investment. Bank regulations also affect the amount of capital they must retain as backing funds for depositors and such. Taxes reduce the amount of funds available to banks by causing investors to find less "stressed" wealth preservation methods.

That's 3 points with a little overlap.

1. For those private investors who have investment capital, taxes reduce the amount available for investment.

That's a pretty general statement. Are you still referring to startup funding or some later round? Back to your reference to Startup funding (post #141) drying up over the last few years. I would think higher interest rates and the wars in Europe and the Middle East were the major causes of that. But either way, taxes have been flat since 2018. How have taxes effected startup funding?

2. Bank regulations also affect the amount of capital they must retain as backing funds for depositors and such.

Yes they do, but they also control the exposure and risk to federally insured banks. One of the root causes of the 2008 Financial Sector Crash was lack of liquidity in FDIC insured institutions. They raised it by .75% During the recovery in 2011. There were obviously other major factors in that situation, like lack of regulations and oversight in Derivatives Markets. Another side bar, The Federal Reserve injected trillions into the economy in the form of Financial Sector Bailouts, Loans to large corporations and quantitate easing, and other than minor fluctuations none of which had any major impact on inflation.

3. Taxes reduce the amount of funds available to banks by causing investors to find less "stressed" wealth preservation methods.

This is a direct result in higher interest rates. Also Angel and Venture Capital funds are not usually associated with "wealth preservation methods" however higher rates changes the dynamics. it definitely modifies the exposure/ return ratio.

 

[ColinEssex]

I think the rules should be to try to keep a line of conversation to a minimum of topics until that has been agreed upon or decided that their can be no agreement. No page long diatribes covering 12 different topics, no more ignoring direct question. If a person elects not to answer they should still address the question.

Does that sound fair?

Actually, I have various topics it would be interesting to discuss with our American friends but I'll not bother because any topic is turned into an American political slagging off, just as it is in dozens of other non political threads.
There is a special political forum for Americans to discuss the same old things. Yet any thread on the watercooler now gets turned into an American politics thread which will only get worse as November gets nearer.
Perhaps when the American election is over, those of us foreigners who have no interest in American politics can resume posting interesting threads for general discussion and non political opinions. Although I doubt the Americans here will let us foreigners have normal discussion without involving the USA politics.
Col

 

[Thales750]

I'm more interested in the economy personally. American politics is at an all time low.

 

[AccessBlaster]

I'm more interested in the economy personally. American politics is at an all time low.

Then why start so many TDS threads? Wouldn't life be easier if you stuck to threads about the economy?

 

[Isaac]

I see, semantics are more important then the big picture. I'll try to make it more precise, scoring points like this is so e debate is obviously important.
in the end I will have plenty of supporting evidence that my position is valid.

Add to this, untaxed increases in wealth. You guys are always saying that taxes should not redistribute wealth, but that is exactly what they do. They redistribute it to the very top.

Where's my big giant wtf button

 

[Isaac]

Actually, I have various topics it would be interesting to discuss with our American friends but I'll not bother because any topic is turned into an American political slagging off, just as it is in dozens of other non political threads.
There is a special political forum for Americans to discuss the same old things. Yet any thread on the watercooler now gets turned into an American politics thread which will only get worse as November gets nearer.
Perhaps when the American election is over, those of us foreigners who have no interest in American politics can resume posting interesting threads for general discussion and non political opinions. Although I doubt the Americans here will let us foreigners have normal discussion without involving the USA politics.
Col

Propose a new topic, I'm all ears. Anything to distract from the disastrous potential of bobblehead's success

 

[AccessBlaster]

Propose a new topic, I'm all ears. Anything to distract from the disastrous potential of bobblehead's success

I'm particularly interested in the UK right now. I've seen more than a few videos of UK migration running a muck. I saw one yesterday of young migrants with swords and knives chasing people. Maybe someone can explain why.

 

[moke123]

Then why start so many TDS threads?

 

[AccessBlaster]

We went from Pee Pads to Knee Pads and that's what makes you guys excited?
Silly liberals.