Yet another tragedy (2 Viewers)

Jeez - if the comments about Col's jibes are dangerous then what about the comments and jokes in threads in the watercooler - about transgender, about is Islam a threat etc... those are just as likely to inflame hatred. Introspection warranted? No?
Yes, and of course don't forget the constant moaning and berating the USA government by 'super' Pat. She blames every little thing on the wrong government policies or on the Democrats or the republicans, yet does nothing constructive to make things better. Obviously if you say anything against her rantings, you get a foul mouthed PM that would make a docker blush or she'll ban you for a while.
Col
 
No, I'm not going to delete you. I'm just going to ask you to understand that I was - and maybe still am - a bit rattled.
So I rattled you, no need for you to say I'm an ally to isis.
We had bombs all over the UK planted by the USA funded IRA, hundreds killed over the years. Your idiot in a pick up is a minor incident. Welcome to reality.
Col
 
Because I was in a rather somber moment, I also said we don't know what will set off a crazy person, you included. And ME included.
Col, that terrorist attack was within a few miles of my home. If my response betrayed a bit of nerves, it was because the event was truly unsettling. The attack was at least 150 times closer to me than it was to you. I used to work one block away from where the perpetrator crashed his vehicle and came out shooting. If that wouldn't make you at least a little bit upset, you've got a stronger disposition than I do.
It must be very concerning Doc, particularly so soon after the same in Germany. How has I got this bad?

In the 1970s we went down to London and took photos of our daughter on the steps to 10 Downing Street. There were a couple of constables mooching about and that was it. Today it is double, or triple fenced and with police all over with automatic weapons.

Maybe we have been subjected to the boiling frog scenario over the last fifty years instead of governments' sorting it out. Apparently we now have to be observant whilst out in a pedestrian shopping area, in case the delivery vehicle isn't but maybe some weirdo on a mission to kill and injure. At the same time we have one of 2Tierkier Starmer's clowns telling us not to go out for three days because it is icy and civil servants "working" from Thailand instead of their offices.
 
In the 1970s we went down to London and took photos of our daughter on the steps to 10 Downing Street. There were a couple of constables mooching about and that was it. Today it is double, or triple fenced and with police all over with automatic weapons.
The extra security at Downing St was brought in as a reaction to the bombings and threats made by the IRA, funded of course by the USA. You will recall that the IRA bombed the Grand Hotel in Brighton where Margaret Thatcher and most top politicians were staying during their party conference.
If there was little or no security at Downing St like in the 'old' days and a tragedy attack happened, the first question would be why not more security?
There are so many idiot religious terrorist groups now who delight in killing, sadly there is no choice but to protect things more heavily. We would all love the freedom we enjoyed 50 or 60 years ago. Not to be anymore.
Col
 
Jeez - if the comments about Col's jibes are dangerous then what about the comments and jokes in threads in the watercooler - about transgender, about is Islam a threat etc... those are just as likely to inflame hatred. Introspection warranted? No?

Yes, warranted. Let me ponder that for a bit to challenge my instincts that tell me this is 'different somehow'. I will post back.
 

Which edicts of Christianity exist in some countries that many would be uncomfortable to acknowledge? I'm aware of at least 1, subjectively speaking, but I'm wondering which ones you are thinking of.
 
Which edicts of Christianity exist in some countries that many would be uncomfortable to acknowledge? I'm aware of at least 1, subjectively speaking, but I'm wondering which ones you are thinking of.
Good morning Isaac and happy New Year. I assume you are asking me that question. Being married to a devout Christian and her family, this is a subject that has come up in the past and I avoid with her and her parents because they have no objectivity and simp[ly will not have a rational conversation about it.

Every religion out there thinks theirs are the "right" one and will support and defend their position with equal intensity. She has no problem calling Catholics and Jehovah Witnesses cults, but when I point out that she and others in our church exhibit the same behavior she grows fangs and hisses at me. I have learned to choose what hill I want to die on, and this aint it!
 
Introspection

While it is undeniable that transgender, Islam, and Americans have all been subjects of critique, the nature and tone of these critiques differ substantially, and it is important to recognize these distinctions. The critique directed at Islam, for example, has generally adhered to statements about specific actions, ideas, or behaviors of Muslims which are (considered) themselves dangerous. They are concerns directly stated as such and grounded in reasoned arguments with a basis of fear of the outcome or results of unlimited Islamic growth taking over countries. The critiques from me aimed at transgender issues usually involve specific beliefs about when & where transgender ideology is appropriate to permit (i.e. elementary schools vs. consenting adults), or involve statements of belief or fact regarding biological realities and in support of people's rights (i.e. the right not to be forced to share a bathroom or a trophy with someone nominally excluded from a sport or restroom privacy, the right to have an opinion on the issue without being cancelled or fired, the right to teach your children your own values, etc. etc.)

In contrast, the negative discourse surrounding 'Americans' has ventured into more disparaging, sweeping and insulting territory. It is rarely meant as the basis of meaningful conversation or a fear or something Americans might do or harm coming from them, and is more based on stereotypes that have been widely known over 100's of years to cause people to be radicalized against Americans, inflict terrorist-type damage at Americans, or wage war against Americans. A critique of a group that states "I think this group is dangerous" (like your own about Judeaism and Christianity) is more acceptable than a statement like "illegitimate occupier American warmongers who think of nothing but shooting people", for, what I hope are obvious reasons which I have somewhat laid out.

While it is possible to critique an entity or group with an intent to inform or challenge, the negative banter directed at Americans have largely employed slanderous and insulting rhetoric, which when taught to an entire generation of people in a nation or demographic tends to result in a deep seated hatred of Americans that directly leads to violence - rather than engage in a meaningful, thoughtful critique. The difference here lies not in the act of critique itself, but in the manner of its delivery.

I wholeheartedly accept your challenge regarding the consistency of messaging, and I stand by the notion that constructive critique is always preferable to slander.

I'll save you the time of going out and finding posts on Transgenders or Muslims that fall into the insulting category right now by admitting that there have been. To that extent, and under the shade of the way I feel about the "bad American stereotype"'s harmful effects ...... I admit that some TG /Muslim posts probably DO qualify as being overly disparaging, exaggerated, false, sweeping, or insulting to the extent that it may reasonably be expected to inspire violence or quasi-violent treatment.

The idea that all Americans are warmongers and occupiers has been a direct basis for terrorist violence. There really is no denying it.
The idea that all Americans are loud, uncouth, uneducated, uncultured fools has been a direct basis (in my opinion) for the way Americans often get treated en masse when visiting, for example, the UK (I know because I went there and experienced it).

For example, I may say it disgusts me that people are out there trying to teach transgenderism to 11 yr old girls, but I should not say that transgender people disgust me. I may point out incidents of violence by transgender people against others, but I should not attempt to paint them all like that. If that difference isn't big and important to us, then we know not the difference between actions and humans.

I for one will try to do a better job of avoiding the insulting type of rhetoric against a people group, at least that type of nasty stereotype-rhetoric which I think inspires people for a deep seated hatred of Americans, I'll try to avoid falling into doing the same thing to others.

Maybe I'll use as a litmus test in my mind, something like: "Is this statement or joke mostly false, and also the type of idea that causes deep seated hatred against _____ group of people?" - If yes, I'll try to remember to refrain from it.
 
Good morning Isaac and happy New Year. I assume you are asking me that question. Being married to a devout Christian and her family, this is a subject that has come up in the past and I avoid with her and her parents because they have no objectivity and simp[ly will not have a rational conversation about it.

Every religion out there thinks theirs are the "right" one and will support and defend their position with equal intensity. She has no problem calling Catholics and Jehovah Witnesses cults, but when I point out that she and others in our church exhibit the same behavior she grows fangs and hisses at me. I have learned to choose what hill I want to die on, and this aint it!

I hear ya. I for one am the first to admit that in Christianity there are tons of: Phonies, Hypocrites, Acting Pedophiles, Sexual abusers, Control freaks, Liars, etc. I don't see it as having anything to do with the truth of the Message, just the hardness of following it.

But I know what you mean ... some people don't wish to admit that in every religious faction there are those.

I personally point more to Jesus than Christians. He didn't say "follow my followers", he said "Follow Me".
 
You will recall that the IRA bombed the Grand Hotel in Brighton where Margaret Thatcher and most top politicians were staying during their party conference.
The bombing of the Grand wasn't funny of course but there was a funny part to it. Apparently Maggie was on the toilet when the bomb went off.
I'd absolutely no time for the woman, detested the sight and sound of her. No more understanding of macro economics that Rachel from accounts complaints. So delighted when I heard that, couldn't happen to a nastier person.
 
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I'm sorry.
That's a start. Perhaps you can reflect on the actions you take that cause you to run afoul of the moderators and stop with your personal attacks and harassment of other members. No one cares about your silly opinions of the US that seem to be based on old westerns and other fictional stories. You can attack public figures if that floats your boat. No one cares. But you do not personally attack or harass other members of this forum, PERIOD. We may have wildly different opinions and argue politics but it isn't personal. YOU make things personal and that is unacceptable behavior.

Let's all have a Happy New Year.
 
You can attack public figures if that floats your boat. No one cares. But you do not personally attack or harass other members of this forum, PERIOD. YOU make things personal and that is unacceptable behavior.
That better apply to certain moderators as well. FULL STOP
Col
 
Although it did also read that Doc was rattled by my post.

Already corrected you once on that. The event in New Orleans is what rattled me. It was too close to home. My comments about your constant sniping of USA figures and foibles was merely a rumination during a time of emotional upset. Don't arrogate so much importance to yourself.

For what it is worth, I remember reading about the IRA conflicts from many years ago, late 1960s and for a couple of decades after that. I can see how something that close to YOUR home would be unsettling. I will not make a joke about that. Things that lead to deaths of innocent people aren't funny.
 
Don't press your luck and you need a better memory. Let us not forget, the internet lives forever so our SINGLE exchange which you constantly and PUBLICLY misrepresent, is available for review and it will be very clear what happened. YOU were attempting to cause a legal problem for my family. I was protecting my family. That goes far beyond even a personal attack. You never learn do you:poop:
 
That better apply to certain moderators as well. FULL STOP

Only if your attitude and sniping come to a FULL STOP as well. That is not a directive, though. It is merely an observation of an instance of a profoundly simple idea. "What goes around comes around."

You get what you give. The Golden Rule occurs not only in Christianity but in other religions as well. "As you sow, so shall you reap." (Gal 6:7) If you want us to stop calling you out, you have to stop the action that triggers the call-out. FULL STOP.

I want to clarify this post: I'm not acting as a moderator to order you to do / not do something. I'm a member simply saying if you don't like the responses you get, pay more attention to the comments you give.
 
Don't press your luck and you need a better memory. Let us not forget, the internet lives forever so our SINGLE exchange which you constantly and PUBLICLY misrepresent, is available for review and it will be very clear what happened. YOU were attempting to cause a legal problem for my family. I was protecting my family. That goes far beyond even a personal attack. You never learn do you:poop:
Then I suggest you consider carefully what details that may be sensitive, you post on a public forum. You can't blame people for picking up on a comment. You posted it. You live with it.
Col
 

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