Are you an atheist?

[dan-cat]

Ummm, I think I already did. I just can't figure out why you are beating a dead horse.

You asked a question so I answered it. I'll stop beating it when you ask me to stop or when I get bored of it. Whichever comes first.

 

[Pauldohert]

The entire analogy is grounded on comparing a believer to a group of individuals who deny that 2+2 = 4. The analogy is flawed. Throw it away and start again.

Thank the lord! A slur I call it.

It would depend on what base you are in though?

 

[Alisa]

You asked a question so I answered it. I'll stop beating it when you ask me to stop or when I get bored of it. Whichever comes first.

I'm already bored, so lets talk about something else.

 

[oumahexi]

I'm already bored, so lets talk about something else.

OK, here's on for everybody.

People who believe in God believe in the soul.
Do Ahteists believe we have a soul?
What happens to the soul when we die?
there is a theory that the soul weight around 5oz, because people have been weighed immediately after death and consistently appear to have lost that amount. So, if it can be weighed, how come we can't see it on an x-ray?

 

[Pauldohert]

I'm already bored, so lets talk about something else.

Are you conceding all the paralels/analogies between those who disagree with you on the belief of God and the stupid or proven wrong.

Or do you still think them valid.

Careful -cos one's reality and one's imagination! And unfortunaltely the basis of you argument now seems to be your imagination!

 

[Alisa]

OK, here's on for everybody.

People who believe in God believe in the soul.
Do Ahteists believe we have a soul?
What happens to the soul when we die?
there is a theory that the soul weight around 5oz, because people have been weighed immediately after death and consistently appear to have lost that amount. So, if it can be weighed, how come we can't see it on an x-ray?

That sounds a little fishy to me, were they weighed immedietly BEFORE they died too? How did they know they were about to die? Sounds like an urban legend to me . . .
But to answer the first part of the question, no, I don't think we have a "soul". I think that is just a word we use to describe what is intangibly human about ourselves, and I also think that when we are dead, we are dead, that is it.

Ok, found some info on this:
http://www.snopes.com/religion/soulweight.asp

Not too convincing . . .

 

[Alc]

..many of us are tired of the "conversation."

So stop posting?

How many have you made now, along the lines of "I'm tired of this" or "There's no point in particpating"?

If it bothers you that much, just stop.

 

[Alisa]

So stop posting?

How many have you made now, along the lines of "I'm tired of this" or "There's no point in particpating"?

If it bothers you that much, just stop.

They are not the only one that ends each post with a statement along the lines of I'm not going to bother discussing this anymore - there are quite a few posters who do it. I think it is their way of wrangling the last word, not an actual expression of exhaustion, because they always seem to pop back up eventually.

 

[oumahexi]

That sounds a little fishy to me, were they weighed immedietly BEFORE they died too? How did they know they were about to die? Sounds like an urban legend to me . . .
But to answer the first part of the question, no, I don't think we have a "soul". I think that is just a word we use to describe what is intangibly human about ourselves, and I also think that when we are dead, we are dead, that is it.

You know, the theory I read was so long ago I can't say for sure if the people were weighed immediately before, but I'm sure it would have been close to death. I do remember they were terminal patients who had given consent to the procedure. It would be interesting to hear if anyone else has heard that theory?

I know there are many theories about death, and of course the most comforting for me is that you stay dead, it's like going to sleep and never wakening up. But I like sleeping because I have such wonderful dreams - so do I take comfort from that because I think I'll "die happily ever after?" I don't know.

As a hypnotherapist, I've often been approached by people who want "past life regression" to see what they were in previous lives. Personally, I don't see the point, you're here now and it's the here and now you have to deal with. But many people believe that they are here to deal with problems from a past life. At first I though "yeah, they'll all come out as 'Cleopatra' or some other famous character from history", surprisingly out of some 20 cases (not all of which I have led), I have only seen one case where a famous character was brought forward.

 

[Pauldohert]

So stop posting?

How many have you made now, along the lines of "I'm tired of this" or "There's no point in particpating"?

If it bothers you that much, just stop.

I admire their perseverence - many a time in life we just want to quit. But God instills the will to carry on!

Those who don't beleive in God, just quit presumably when tired? Or aat least try to persaude others to?

 

[Alc]

OK, here's on for everybody.

People who believe in God believe in the soul.
Do Ahteists believe we have a soul?
What happens to the soul when we die?
there is a theory that the soul weight around 5oz, because people have been weighed immediately after death and consistently appear to have lost that amount. So, if it can be weighed, how come we can't see it on an x-ray?

A theory 'tested' in 1907 under less than stringent medical conditions
The second answer here
http://answers.google.com/answers/threadview/id/568373.html
provides a lot of links about it.

Speaking as an atheist - but as an individual, mind, not on behalf of all atheists - no, I don't think anyone has a soul (despite what James Brown claimed to know).

 

[Alc]

I admire their perseverence - many a time in life we just want to quit. But God instills the will to carry on!

I reminds me of back when Princess Diana was alive and she made many a public statement to say that she didn't want any more publicity.

Those who don't beleive in God, just quit presumably when tired? Or aat least try to persaude others to?

We don't go knocking on people's doors during mealtimes to show them booklets and try to get them to quit, though

 

[Pauldohert]

We don't go knocking on people's doors during mealtimes to show them booklets and try to get them to quit, though

Maybe you could print off Alisa's convincing argument and give it a go?

 

[Alc]

Maybe you could print off Alisa's convincing argument and give it a go?

Knowing my luck, the householder would have a copy of Fire2Ice's contributions and could counter by pointing out how clever they are and how noone should argue with them unless they're agreeing with them.

 

[georgedwilkinson]

I'm already bored, so lets talk about something else.

They are not the only one that ends each post with a statement along the lines of I'm not going to bother discussing this anymore - there are quite a few posters who do it. I think it is their way of wrangling the last word, not an actual expression of exhaustion, because they always seem to pop back up eventually.

Huh? Now it's a perceived flaw of Christians to not want to beat our heads up against a wall convincing the unconvincable but it's OK for you?

I understand your exasperation. I feel the same pain.

But you can't decide it's ok for you to live by a seperate set of rules than those you criticize without being called on it. You thought you were going to wrangle the last word? Looks like you popped back up right away.

 

[BarryMK]

I have never believed in the supernatural. I have never believed in God or gods. My mother professed to believe but my father I don’t think held any religious belief. I was, I think fortunate that my parents never tried to instil any beliefs in me other than good manners and considerate behaviour. Others would have to judge how successful they were on that…..

I first came into contact with religion in the form of Christianity when I started school at 5 years old. Initially I accepted the mild indoctrination involved at infants school but soon started asking questions - invariably not getting answers that I felt were any different from the fairy tales we were read in the afternoons. By the age of 7 or 8 I was pretty well read and very much an independent thinker. I decided pretty soon that I didn’t buy the stories I heard and didn’t trust the types of people who were insisting that I should believe in Jesus/God whatever, especially one “Holy Joe” RE teacher who always belittled anyone in class who dared to question Christianity.

My best friend at Junior and Senior school was a Roman Catholic and it became pretty obvious that although he was compelled by family and church to conform he did not believe any of it but was also riddled by guilt that he didn’t - one example where the brainwash them from infancy approach didn’t quite work. Other children who did believe all seemed to have parents who believed and went to church so they had to attend Sunday School, services etc. - examples to my mind where it did work and just look at Islam - faith hammered into people from birth.

My stance is if you want to believe and you’re not hurting anyone else fine go ahead and take whatever comfort you need from your faith - just don’t knock on my door to sell me your fantasies for that’s what they are to me. I promise not to knock on your door in return and try to proselytise my views.

I have no fear of burning in hell nor expectation of toddling off to heaven. Heaven and hell are here already, seems to me it just depends on luck how much of each drops in your lap.

When I tread on an ant do I worry about its soul or whether it was a sinner and will roast or a good ant and will go to the great anthill in the sky? No it’s a dead ant - a defunct ant - a deceased ant just like Monty Python’s parrot. If I run over a dog in my car - sad but exactly the same. If I were to shoot a gorilla in Africa - likewise. If I killed a fellow human - likewise. For me all the evidence points to when you’re dead - you’re dead. We’re just animals and I think it a terrible conceit to believe that just because our intelligence has allowed us to develop language and direct our own destinies much more than our fellow creatures that we must somehow deserve a second bite at the cherry of life.

It’s all wishful thinking as far as I’m concerned. The only regret I have is that when I die, if I’m right about all this - I’ll never have the satisfaction of saying “I told you so!”

 

[Rabbie]

Well said Barry! Bravo

 

[Alisa]

Huh? Now it's a perceived flaw of Christians to not want to beat our heads up against a wall convincing the unconvincable but it's OK for you?

I understand your exasperation. I feel the same pain.

But you can't decide it's ok for you to live by a seperate set of rules than those you criticize without being called on it. You thought you were going to wrangle the last word? Looks like you popped back up right away.

What on earth are you talking about?

I just think its a little mealy mouthed to say, I won't be contributing or posting anymore, and then come back and post some more, as so many on this thread have done. I have never said that I won't bother contributing anymore.

 

[oumahexi]

We’re just animals and I think it a terrible conceit to believe that just because our intelligence has allowed us to develop language and direct our own destinies much more than our fellow creatures that we must somehow deserve a second bite at the cherry of life.

Well said! Although I do feel remorse at taking any life, I don't see the difference between the life of an ant and the life of a human, both are equally relevant to the inhabitants of that body.

The only regret I have is that when I die, if I’m right about all this - I’ll never have the satisfaction of saying “I told you so!”

But if you were wrong, would you be quick to come back and tell us?

 

[dan-cat]

What on earth are you talking about?

Something to do with the discussion of your anologies becoming boring very soon after they have been shown to be wrong, methinks.