Riots in Minneapolis

[Jon]

The reason I post so many tables of stats is to give a more objective representation of what is going on out there. It bypasses all the media bias and political outrage, and gets straight to the facts as we best know them.

But humans are emotional creatures and they latch onto a belief and won't let go until the end of times. Evidence becomes irrelevant.

 

[Steve R.]

The US is descending into anarchy.

It's very sad and depressing. It's bad enough that there's tons of crime, and too much anarchy. But there's one thing that's even worse than that: Selective prosecution based on political context. Now that's scary.

Not only do we have anarchy situations (Jan 6th, BLM) but with Biden's DOJ in charge, we also have prosecution geared toward making the offenders suffer the most who are not fitting nicely in with the approved Democrat narrative. Ashli Babbit tresspassing=killed, no outrage, no information, no prosecution. Daunte fleeing police=killed, much outrage, much prosecution.

We have decreasing respect for for the hierarchy of the law.

• Sanctuary states/cities/counties - The political leaders of these jurisdictions instead of trying to uphold federal law, protect illegal immigrants from arrest.
• Covid: Various Governors and mayors have been imposing (questionable) restrictions on the populous. The populous is now giving those restrictions the middle finger and ignoring them.
• Gun Control: Certain political leader have attempted to impose restrictions on gun ownership. Some law enforcement personnel are refusing to comply with those restrictions.

In summary, we are seeing the populous and some political leaders refusing to comply with the dictates of those above them in the hierarchy. That translates into anarchy.

 

[Pat Hartman]

That's 4 crimes right there. Is that what they call on the mend?

This only reinforces our descent into being a banana republic. Crimes are only crimes if they are committed by certain people. Other people get a pass. Worst case is they get arrested but are then let out on their own recognizance and the crime never gets prosecuted because the prosecutors elect to drop the charges.

People who participated in the Jan 6 break in are STILL IN JAIL and being held without bail!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! For what crime? Trespassing????? Destruction of property? But the Capitol police officer who shot to kill at point blank range an unarmed woman who posed no threat to him gets a pass because the prosecutor disagrees with the victim's politics? Where are the mobs rioting over this travesty of justice? Why are the looters in Minneapolis not being prosecuted? How about the scum that burned down the police station in Portland? How are those not crimes?

 

[moke123]

 

[Jon]

Yes, I do see the contrast:

- No indication if he is guilty of any crime whatsoever, unlike multiple crimes and warrant out for the arrest of Daunte Wright
- He was not trying to be handcuffed at the time
- Did the police have any right to tell him to get out of the car? I have no idea on what your laws are over there. Does anyone know?
- He kept his hands visible
- He was not fighting with two officers. There are different levels of resistance, as l learned from the George Floyd trial
- Suggestion that one of the officers did not have his body cam switched on, violating protocol.

The Daunte Wright case was a clear accident.

You can focus on just small aspects of that video if you like, and ignore the rest of it. That is your choice.

 

[Steve R.]

The Daunte Wright case was a clear accident.

Accidents are incomprehensible for those on the "left". The only narrative allowed is that this was a clear example of a White police officer purposely killing a Black man implementing the genocide against Black people. (sarcasm) The word "accident" will never be uttered by the complicit media.

 

[moke123]

Yes, I do see the contrast:

- No indication if he is guilty of any crime whatsoever, unlike multiple crimes and warrant out for the arrest of Daunte Wright
- He was not trying to be handcuffed at the time
- Did the police have any right to tell him to get out of the car? I have no idea on what your laws are over there. Does anyone know?
- He kept his hands visible
- He was not fighting with two officers. There are different levels of resistance, as l learned from the George Floyd trial
- Suggestion that one of the officers did not have his body cam switched on, violating protocol.

The Daunte Wright case was a clear accident.

You can focus on just small aspects of that video if you like, and ignore the rest of it. That is your choice.

Ohio police body camera video shows tense traffic stop involving driver with a gun

Newly-released body camera video from an Ohio police department shows an intense exchange between law enforcement and a driver with a gun.

www.cleveland19.com

Did the police have any right to tell him to get out of the car? I have no idea on what your laws are over there. Does anyone know?

Not sure about Ohio, but generally when you get an exit order you are considered in custody.

 

[Jon]

Apparently they followed him and arrested him later. It seems unclear what for.

But what happens when this video is shown as evidence as how police treat whites verses blacks, is it is highly inflammatory. Cherry picking what happens just shows the one instance. What about all the instances when police do not shoot blacks when they don't comply, and all the whites who have been shot when they don't comply? Then do this in the context of an accident, where their intention was to use a taser on Daunte, not a gun, and people lump everything in together as police just want to shoot back men and that there is a two tier justice system. This leads to riots, with more death and destruction.

Unless of course you believe showing a video of one instance proves the case of a two tier justice system. "My granny lived to 95 years old and she smoked 60 per day. Proof cigarettes are safe!"

 

[Jon]

Besides all the above, if the George Floyd trial doesn't get the show trial outcome liberals demand, America is going to be in flames nationwide. The left-wing media is culpable of inciting race hatred, leading to boiling point. I hope everybody doesn't lose their heads over this.

Do jury members openly discuss how they vote and they keep them sequestered until they get to a consensus or just completely blocked?

 

[moke123]

Do jury members openly discuss how they vote and they keep them sequestered until they get to a consensus or just completely blocked?

I dont believe the jury was sequestered. They are free to openly discuss the deliberations after the trial in most places. Some states permit the jury to be polled. I've gotten phone calls from jurors after trials who would tell me about things that happened during deliberations that they felt were wrong.

 

[Jon]

They are being sequestered (if that is the right term) on Monday. I assumed that means lock them in a room and away from any media, perhaps in a hotel for a week or three. The judge said, "Pack your bags."

If it were me, I would put them into some kind of sensory deprivation tank in the middle of the ocean. No wifi, nothing. Let them thrash it out. They can then all agree to convict. Any other verdict and they will be on the hit list.

What happens, do they go around the table and say, "What is your view?" Or do the loud noisy ones try to dominate proceedings and push the quieter ones into submission?

 

[Isaac]

I've heard of jury members "holding out", being a lone 1 or 2 who thought a certain way, with the rest of the group just hammering them until they relent out of exhaustion. I suppose this phenomenon is practically unavoidable, what else can be done? I guess the moral of the story is, if you're on a jury, be a person of principle - always do what you really feel is right, not by pressure.

 

[moke123]

They are being sequestered (if that is the right term) on Monday. I assumed that means lock them in a room and away from any media, perhaps in a hotel for a week or three. The judge said, "Pack your bags."

If it were me, I would put them into some kind of sensory deprivation tank in the middle of the ocean. No wifi, nothing. Let them thrash it out. They can then all agree to convict. Any other verdict and they will be on the hit list.

What happens, do they go around the table and say, "What is your view?" Or do the loud noisy ones try to dominate proceedings and push the quieter ones into submission?

Yes, I see they are going to be sequestered as of monday. They haven't been to date. They will get put up in hotels at night and deliberate during the day. There is usually a foreman assigned who runs the deliberations. Often they will take an initial vote and go from there. I've had juries come back in 15 minutes and others that take several weeks. Sometimes there are bullies who dominate the proceedings especially when deliberations run into days. I've also had cases with multiple hung juries. Chauvins case is likely to be in the appelate courts for years to come.

 

[Jon]

Yes, I see they are going to be sequestered as of monday. They haven't been to date. They will get put up in hotels at night and deliberate during the day. There is usually a foreman assigned who runs the deliberations. Often they will take an initial vote and go from there. I've had juries come back in 15 minutes and others that take several weeks. Sometimes there are bullies who dominate the proceedings especially when deliberations run into days. I've also had cases with multiple hung juries. Chauvins case is likely to be in the appelate courts for years to come.

Have you ever been on a jury? What is an appelate court? How long do you reckon they will deliberate the George Floyd case for?

 

[moke123]

Have you ever been on a jury? What is an appelate court? How long do you reckon they will deliberate the George Floyd case for?

They will never pick me for a jury , one because of what I do, and two because I'm too connected to most of the players.
I doubt it will be too quick because they'll want to make it at least appear to have been thoroughly debated. I'd give it a couple days, if not a hung jury. Then again you never know what they'll do.

An appellate court is where they hear appeals on issues of law. The craziest appeal I've ever had was a murder that got overturned. One of the allegations was that the baby had been burned by a hot air vaporizer. During the deliberations the jury decided to plug it in and run their hands through the steam to see for themselves if it burned. The court held that that was improper and made them witnesses instead of impartial jurors.

 

[Isaac]

If I had to bet money, I'd say they come back with 2nd degree manslaughter guilty. The defense did an OK job in bringing up a few people who sowed considerable doubt (IMO), but I'm doubting it's enough to change the powerful trajectory of this case.

 

[AccessBlaster]

It seems a little late be sequestered why bother they went home every night for two weeks. They've had smart devices with them the entire time.

This trial probably should have been moved to another venue. I mean if it's good enough for the "Juice" why not for Chauvin.

 

[Isaac]

I'm sure Nelson has that on his list of things he might try for appeal on. And I particularly agree on your first comment. From just a common sense perspective, why in the world is sequestration any good when it only starts now??! If the system was lucky enough to get unbiased jurors (even a few) in the first place, they should have done everything possible to preserve that from Day 1. It only takes a few hours of reading to become, potentially, completely biased.

 

[AccessBlaster]

Have you ever been on a jury? What is an appelate court? How long do you reckon they will deliberate the George Floyd case for?

Most folks that sit on jury trials usually fit into a couple of categories, government workers or retirees.

 

[Isaac]

After all is said and done, it seems juries aren't nearly as representative as they probably ought ...

I've never sat on a jury in my life. I've only been harkened for jury duty in ANY way - 1 time. I sat on a chair in a cement hallway in some tiny suburban traffic court for 15 minutes and was then told to go home.

My brother, however, was recently on a major jury trial of a boating while intoxicated + manslaughter case, and has been less involved in 2 others. Why I have no idea. My addresses are generally up to date with the DMV, or else they're within the 1 yr of mail forwarding, and I'm on the voting rolls.

It seems like there are just TOO many excuses and getting out of it that dismisses the majority of less-than-elderly, active, working people